small bike

[Water Warrior 2]

The one thing about rider training courses is the fact that they are not all the same. The more complete and involved they are the more you will learn. Some course are one Saturday afternoon in a parking lot and away you go. Others are much longer and involved with more time to develope riding skills and confidence. The course Lynda and I attended was 30 hours long and we had excellant instruction. Even after decades of riding I did learned quite a bit which translates into more skill and confidence. This also gave Lynda as a new rider the time and practice to overcome any fears about not being able to ride safely. She has become an excellant rider and enjoys the freedom of 2 wheels instead of a cage.
I am sorry for Alan who didn't get much from his riding course. But it was not a total lose I am sure.

[Easy Rider]

Originally Posted by Water Warrior

I am sorry for Alan who didn't get much from his riding course. But it was not a total lose I am sure.

You are assuming that Alan was not a "total loss" to begin with !!! :poked: :crackup

(Sorry, just couldn't pass that one up.) :roll:

[Moedad]

Originally Posted by Water Warrior

The one thing about rider training courses is the fact that they are not all the same. The more complete and involved they are the more you will learn. Some course are one Saturday afternoon in a parking lot and away you go. Others are much longer and involved with more time to develope riding skills and confidence. The course Lynda and I attended was 30 hours long and we had excellant instruction. Even after decades of riding I did learned quite a bit which translates into more skill and confidence. This also gave Lynda as a new rider the time and practice to overcome any fears about not being able to ride safely. She has become an excellant rider and enjoys the freedom of 2 wheels instead of a cage.
I am sorry for Alan who didn't get much from his riding course. But it was not a total lose I am sure.

The class Alan and I took was 4 hours of classroom the 1st night, and 6 hours (approx) each on a Saturday and Sunday morning. Dang thing cost $250 too (aye, there's the rub). Yours would've cost $468.75 at that rate.

[alanmcorcoran]

I tried to be specific in my criticism of the *CA* MSF course, which I think is pretty uniform. And, although $250 is nothing to sneeze at, it wasn't about the price. I think the course is hampered by the fact that you have people in there that have never even seen a motorcycle, some of which may even quit before they hit second gear, mixed with people like me that had already been riding for six weeks to three months and didn't need to spend the first day learning where the horn button is. Plus there's 12 people in the class. For every "exercise", you are split into groups of six, one of which sits. So divide ten hours of "training" into 5 training, 5 sitting. Add in an unnecessary lengthy description of the exercise, read word for word by the (often ex-military/reserve or LE [read "by-the-book"]) instructor from a verbose manual PLUS painfully slow re arrangement of the cones (PAINFULLY SLOW!!!) and you can knock down your potential riding time down to 4-4.5 hours. Then, the first half of most exercises and all of some others, are done ONE at a time while the other five sit. Bottom line? A 15 hour training course that involves about 2 hours of actual riding time and quite a bit of sitting on the bike. I stand by my earlier assessment, and I agree with Moe that it is mostly a feel good thing. If you have never ridden a motorcycle and just want to see what it feels like, I guess it's as good a use of $250 as any. And, yes, you do get to practice stopping a little.

Mostly, you get to take the test without going to the DMV. Yay for that.

[Moedad]

Yeah, and it was hot.

Originally Posted by alanmcorcoran

I tried to be specific in my criticism of the *CA* MSF course, which I think is pretty uniform. And, although $250 is nothing to sneeze at, it wasn't about the price. I think the course is hampered by the fact that you have people in there that have never even seen a motorcycle, some of which may even quit before they hit second gear, mixed with people like me that had already been riding for six weeks to three months and didn't need to spend the first day learning where the horn button is. Plus there's 12 people in the class. For every "exercise", you are split into groups of six, one of which sits. So divide ten hours of "training" into 5 training, 5 sitting. Add in an unnecessary lengthy description of the exercise, read word for word by the (often ex-military/reserve or LE [read "by-the-book"]) instructor from a verbose manual PLUS painfully slow re arrangement of the cones (PAINFULLY SLOW!!!) and you can knock down your potential riding time down to 4-4.5 hours. Then, the first half of most exercises and all of some others, are done ONE at a time while the other five sit. Bottom line? A 15 hour training course that involves about 2 hours of actual riding time and quite a bit of sitting on the bike. I stand by my earlier assessment, and I agree with Moe that it is mostly a feel good thing. If you have never ridden a motorcycle and just want to see what it feels like, I guess it's as good a use of $250 as any. And, yes, you do get to practice stopping a little.

Mostly, you get to take the test without going to the DMV. Yay for that.

[mrlmd1]

Well, I think the course I took in FL. was worth the time and energy involved as well as the expense. Had to drive 50 miles to get there on a Sat & Sun, early in the morning, as well as watch/observe other newbies and oldies go through their motions, hear and try to learn from the instructor's critiques of them as well of me, and I thought it was valuable. I would not discourage any one from taking the course, each individual will get something out of it which will be useful, maybe prevent a disaster. They also offer an advanced rider course, which many come back for later after they gain a little experience, This could also be of some value. If AC had taken the course before riding a while, he may have appreciated it more, and it's harder to unlearn bad habits than to develop new ones. Not trying to be antagonistic, Again, just my opinion.

[Easy Rider]

Originally Posted by alanmcorcoran

Mostly, you get to take the test without going to the DMV. Yay for that.

OK, so the course was designed for those who "had never seen a motorcycle before".

That may be a LARGE part of your objection. Did they at least screen out those who didn't know how to ride a bicycle ?

What do you think those people, in the primary target audience thought about the course ??

It is not possible to please all the people all the time. You are apparently one of the ~5-10% for whom the course completely missed the mark. Sorry for that but I think your personal dislike for it is clouding your good judgement in not recommending it to others.

I think all here now have a clear picture of your opinion on this subject. :horse: :skull:

[Moedad]

I think the gz250 is a small bike relative to a harley elctra-glide or Kawa Vulcan

[Water Warrior 2]

The course we took was 6 hours classroom with the rest on the bikes. A class size of 6 riders and 1 instructor. The only school in the province licensed to teach other instructors too. Price was $700 big ones. We both considered it an investment in our skills and safety. I of course had to unlearn some bad habits before learning good ones. I was also the oldest most experienced rider and the only one to drop a bike when my knee hooked the handlebar while in a low speed manuever. We also spent 4/5 hours a day commuting for this course so it really was an investment for us. The smaller class size was a big bonus to everyone involved.

[Moedad]

Originally Posted by Water Warrior

Price was $700 big ones.

Whew! I'll stop whining about my $250.