Hey, I didn't get to chip in on the gun hijacked thread

[Water Warrior 2]

Music Man, yup the penalties are just a slap on the wrist here too. Heaven forbid we offend some poor cretin from a dysfunctional family.
This next little bit may sound extreme but it worked. Years ago(40?) I talked to a Lady of European decent and she said in her country nobody went to prison twice. Wish I could remember which country. The prison conditions were very harsh because the prisoners were serving time and the word serve meant something over there. Inmates broke rock in a quarry to supply railroad beds, road beds and other construction. Enough rock had to be sold to support the prison system and cover all costs. That included the guards wages so they were issued whips and clubs to keep the inmates working. Even your fellow inmates would take a swipe at you for slacking off.
If you didn't survive prison no problem. If you did survive you would not take a chance again of going to prison. Anyone actually facing a second prison term was considered smart if they took their own life.
I won't say we should revert to a system as harsh but a real punishment in a real prison might do wonders for first timers to get over a potential life of crime.

[alanmcorcoran]

I actually am a Radiohead fan, but I understand it's not for everyone. No one took my U2, Dave Matthews or Jonas Bros bait earlier, so I guess you are either all fans or actually ladies. (My apologies, ladies!)

Like staying non-zombie, keeping up with popular music is a lot of work and when I get busy with other distractions, I tend to drift out of touch. I really do think the world has heard enough from Robert Plant, Jagger & Co and Mr. Springsteen, but apparently I'm in the minority on that one too.

[Easy Rider]

Originally Posted by patrick_777

They're GREEK...of course not.

Figures that a guy from Oklahoma would know all about cute/ugly sheep !!! :shocked: :crackup

[alanmcorcoran]

Re the prison rant. California has a unique situation. Our state is sort of run by the prison guards. (via the prison guards union.) (I'm completely serious, look it up.) They got the "three strikes" law passed, and so we have a lot of lifers, some whose third offense was shoplifting. (not saying these guys should get leniency, but it costs a ton to keep them in prison till they die. Plus, it's a little harsh.) We've spent lot more on prisons in the last ten years than we have on schools, but it's nowhere near enough. We've been piling them into smaller and smaller cages. The feds recently ruled we are probably going have to let about 40% of them out. Plus we are seriously out of money and no one will lend us anymore.

The California state prisons are not nice. They have one named after me. (CSP-Corcoran.) Supposed to house about 3000 inmates. Current population is north of 5000. Home of such notables as Juan Corona, Sirhan Sirhan and, our good buddy, Charles Manson. Guards used to stage "gladiator fights" there. Loser got shot by the guards. (Again, not kidding.) I know you guys think every one in prison deserves to be there, and for about half of them, I'd agree. But how many of you know some doing 25 to life because they would not roll on their pot supplier? A lot of the inmates are in on "war on drugs" related offenses. Some of them are, "I killed a rival dealer" type offenses, but a lot of them are just young, dumb entrepreneurs that didn't think they'd end up in prison.

But at least the weather's nice.

[music man]

If you commit THREE different crimes that are serious enough to get you a prison sentence on three separate occasions, in other words, do a crime, go to prison get out, do a crime...... you get the picture, you shouldn't go to prison for life, you should just be put down, because it is PAINFULLY OBVIOUS to me that you are NEVER going to be able to be a functional human being.


Just about everyone deserves a second chance, except for people who do truly heinous acts the first time, but NO ONE and I mean NO ONE deserves a fourth chance to commit a felony (especially a violent one) and just get to go to prison for a few years for it.

So I do not think that it is too harsh for someone to "just shoplift" on their third offense and get life in prison, yea it would be harsh to get life in prison for shoplifting, but that is not what we are talking about, this person has already committed several other crimes, it just so happens shoplifting was the last straw. There are some members of society that are NEVER going to contribute anything but heartache and sorrow to the world and they should be treated accordingly.

The whole drug related prison sentence thing is also a whole other issue, you have pot dealers rubbing elbows with rapists and murderers, it is truly ridiculous. :facepalm:

[mrlmd1]

Florida has an interesting 10-20-life rule for crimes committed with a gun:
Use a gun in a crime- mandatory 10 year sentence
Fire the gun, whether you hit someone or not- mandatory 20 years
Shoot someone, whether you wound or kill them- mandatory life sentence

I don't know how much of a deterrent this is, because if you shoot someone you may as well kill them as the punishment's the same. And, depending on your age, there may be little difference in just firing off a shot to scare someone and killing someone and hope you can get away. It may be an incentive for a more violent crime than was originally intended. :??:

[Water Warrior 2]

Many years ago a friend of mine in law enforcement had a theory. Society will try to rehabilitate a criminal 2 times. 3rd time you commit an offense you have proven yourself unfit for society. Therefore a small 38 caliber implant should be installed behind the left ear soonest. Prisons would not be as crowded after a while.

[Moedad]

Javert, is that you?

Originally Posted by music man

If you commit THREE different crimes that are serious enough to get you a prison sentence on three separate occasions, in other words, do a crime, go to prison get out, do a crime...... you get the picture, you shouldn't go to prison for life, you should just be put down, because it is PAINFULLY OBVIOUS to me that you are NEVER going to be able to be a functional human being.


Just about everyone deserves a second chance, except for people who do truly heinous acts the first time, but NO ONE and I mean NO ONE deserves a fourth chance to commit a felony (especially a violent one) and just get to go to prison for a few years for it.

So I do not think that it is too harsh for someone to "just shoplift" on their third offense and get life in prison, yea it would be harsh to get life in prison for shoplifting, but that is not what we are talking about, this person has already committed several other crimes, it just so happens shoplifting was the last straw. There are some members of society that are NEVER going to contribute anything but heartache and sorrow to the world and they should be treated accordingly.

The whole drug related prison sentence thing is also a whole other issue, you have pot dealers rubbing elbows with rapists and murderers, it is truly ridiculous. :facepalm:

[mr. softie]

I have a friend in Texas who received a 25 year sentence in the state penitentiary because the cops found an old 1" long roach under the seat of his used pickup during a "routine" traffic stop. He swore it wasn't his but they had a zero tolerance policy, and he had no dough for a lawyer. Kangaroo Court. He was released after 10 years in various units. He had gotten into an argument with the arresting officer about a week before he was arrested.

13% of the convicts on death row in Illinois were found to be innocent with DNA evidence, 80% of those were convicted with what turned out to be faulty eyewitness identification despite evidence to the contrary which was disallowed at their trial.

I was arrested years ago (in Mississippi) and sent to jail for three days with no phone call and with no evidence at all of any crime but I had long hair and worse, I was a Yankee! No hearing or anything. I told them my Daddy was a lawyer up north and we would sue if they didn't let me out. Upon my release the cop told me to bring a 38 with me next time I came down there????

I have another friend who did a YEAR in county jail. His crime was being asleep in the back seat of a car when his "buddies" stole a quart of oil from a gas station. They turned evidence on him, in exchange for getting off themselves.

I guess my point being that just because a person has been convicted of a crime idoesn't mean they committed one. So before we start executing them we had better be damn sure they did something to deserve getting arrested in the first place. Not just because of a quota or a personal grudge. Arrests are made all the time for a variety of reasons, not all of them bona fide.

[alanmcorcoran]

:plus1:

Well put Mr. Softie. I have to disqualify myself from having an unbiased opinion on these things (because, in plain terms, I DO have a problem with authority) but I can attest that justice is usually not dispensed like you see on "Law and Order."

Between bullshit puritan laws (drugs, prostitution stings, etc.), outrageous snitch witness deals, suspect forensic "science", and overworked/underpaid public defenders, it's easy to be falsely convicted, even if your crime is nothing more than you happened to be at the wrong place at the wrong time.

If you are a nonconformist, you're already guilty of disrespecting society and they'll be all to happy to give you a reason to justify your contempt.