[dhgeyer]

Originally Posted by alanmcorcoran

I know dh picked up a Beemer recently and I figure some of you other enthusiasts might have some experience. Not sure I am even close to making the leap, but, this is how these things start.

I was wondering, what are main differences between the various 1200's and the 1300 GT? If money is no object, why wouldn't I get the 1300 GT? Is the riding position more sportbike and less cruiser? There's a 3K accessory package that includes things like a Xenon headlamp, ABS breaks, and some other farkles - Again, if money is no object, would I want this?

Dh, you traded one or two bikes in - what kind of dough did you get? Bare minimum, about what you could have sold them for, or... more?

I think the list on the fully farkled 1300 GT is 22 or 23K. Do they really sell them for that? Or is it typically discounted?

First, let me say that, while I am overall pleased with the make and model I bought, I am, and have been somewhat disillusioned with BMW. This wasn't a surprise after I bought the bike. I knew it going in. But, sadly, my perception has been confirmed. I bought the one I bought for a couple of reasons, one logical, one very illogical. When I was a teenager, a couple of people I knew and really looked up to rode white BMWs, which in the mid to late 60's were the best quality bikes available. I always wanted one, and when I saw that white one in the showroom, and it was the exact model I knew I wanted, I was had. As for the logical reason, the BMW R1200R is one of very few "standard" configuration bikes left on the market, and it is by far the easiest to work on.

Upside of BMW - they are on the cutting edge of technology, have good resale value, enjoy a good, although increasingly undeserved reputation, and are generally great riding machines. They run amazingly well, handle amazingly well, and are a joy to ride.

Downside of BMW - their quality control has suffered in recent years, and they do not support their products well at all. They continue to produce designs proven to be defective for years, and will not acknowledge the problems, or make any effort to resolve them. Probably the worst and most widely known instance of this is the horrible rate of final drive failures, which left hundreds of people stranded, and with very expensive repairs. They kept manufacturing this final drive on most of their models for many years, and never admitted that there was a problem. They do seem to have fixed this on the latest generation, thank God! Unless you do your own work, BMWs are very expensive to own. There is a lot of routine maintenance, and, believe me, they don't give it away. This doesn't affect me so much, as I plan to do all that myself. On the model I bought, because it's a naked bike, it's very easy to do. But, the downside of even that is that I needed to buy some specialized tools, and they don't give those away either. I even had to buy a computer program and special hookup in order to access the central electronics, which is needed to do a simple throttle body synchronization!

Unless you are very knowledgeable about each generation of bike and what its weaknesses are likely to be, and know how to deal with them, you might be better off with another brand.

There is a downside to being on the cutting edge, also. They don't use a normal float in the gas tank as a sending unit for the fuel gauge. They use a sensing strip. These strips have been failing at about 10%. Mine failed after about 1500 miles. It was replaced under warranty, but there are lots of cases of them failing repeatedly. On the upside, even my naked bike has more instrumentation than I have ever seen on a bike, or on some cars. It's really nice.

As to the 1200 as opposed to the 1300: they are completely different engine designs. BMW is now making about 5 basic architectures, all the way from the BMW traditional (flat opposed twin with longitudinal gearbox, two plate dry clutch and shaft drive) to the standard Jap bike architecture (transverse mounted unit engine and transmission, multiplate wet clutch, and chain drive) and 3 or so designs in between. Many of the latest models are made in China, and the Chinese bikes seem to be at least as good quality as the German made ones.

If you are interested in this brand, you need to really study up on it, visit a large dealership with lots of models, hang out on the forums, and generally find out what they're all about.

I did pretty well on the trade for the Concours, not so well on the BMW 850. At that point I really didn't care. I'm kicking myself, because I had the 850 on Craigslist last Summer and had good solid offers. I got a lot less when I traded it in. You can't expect to get top trade in in the Winter in NH.

BMW does run some specials, but other than that they don't deal much. I got mine with some very attractive factory specials going on all at once, which definitely softened the blow. Of course, one of the special deals was free hard bags, keyed to the bike. They're huge, very secure, and easily dismount and become suitcases - ideal for touring. About a thousand dollar value. Bad news is, it took over a month to get them, and no one at BMW USA would lower themselves to talk to me or the dealer to let us know what was going on. Like I said, they're a lousy company to deal with.

I don't know much about the 1300cc models, as I have no interest in them. ABS is very much worth having. BMW does not make anything that even remotely resembles a cruiser. They did some years ago, but the cylinders sticking out the sides made the feet forward riding position impossible, so it really wasn't a cruiser, and went over like a lead balloon. My bike is a "standard" - upright riding position, feet under me, naked bike. Much of what BMW makes falls somewhere on a continuum from sport bikes to sport touring bikes, with varying degrees of fairing, storage, and amenities. They do make a luxury touring machine to compete with the Gold Wing. The Gold Wing is a far better deal in my opinion. They also make a line of "adventure touring" bikes (models that end in "GS"). They're intended for extended touring on or off road. They are very popular in this country, and make up a large percentage of BMW's sales here. I had one as a loaner once, and didn't care much for it. I don't ride much off road.

Don't know if any of this rambling helped, but I hope it did. If you ever get to looking seriously at anything(s), give a holler, maybe I can say something more specific.

Dave