Battery/ Charging issue + made worse by me

[n9643750]

Hello folks,

Thanks in advance for taking a look, I have found this site to be a great resource.

I am having two problems with my 2007 GZ250. Unfortunately I think I caused the second one while trying to rundown the original.

Yesterday I came out to ride the bike to work. It had been in the 40's the night before, but only two days since I had last ridden it. The starter spun, but the engine wouldn't turn over. The starter sounded strong, but I only tried it three or four times as the bike has always started right up. On the drive to work I remembered noticing the headlight flickering with engine idle a few nights ago and wondered if this isn't an electrical problem. Also, the previous owner of the bike told me he had to replace the battery twice in the last year so I began to suspect the charging system. After browsing the internet, I found this site. Wow! what a great resource, you guys are awesome! I downloaded the PDF of the shop manual and found multiple threads that reinforced the idea that batteries need to be charged fully before being installed initially. I don't know if this one or it's predecessor were.
With the day off today I decided I would try jump the bike from another one to see if the problem was electrical. Started right up. I let the bike run a bit and then took it around the block a few times. It ran for a total of about 20 minutes. Then I started following the sequence for testing the electrical system as found in the shop manual:

-no current leaks
-voltage across the battery is 12.4v
-with the engine running at idle the voltage across the battery is 13.7v
-with the engine revved the voltage drops to 13.4v (shouldn't it go up?)

I pulled off the gas tank and started the next steps, however this is where I am less sure of myself. I disconnected what I believe was the stator coil coupler (black coupler with three yellow wires, picture attatched) and started checking for resistance.

-across the female side of the coupler, all possible combinations read .8 ohms

Then I reinstalled the fuel tank and started the bike (from it's own battery).

-voltage readings across those same terminals read around 60v

After killing the power I put my multimeter in diode mode. I have never used this mode before and wonder if I did the next test correctly. When I looked at the diagram in the manual for testing the regulator/ rectifier, it wasn't clear to me which side of the couplers I was supposed to be testing (socket or pin). I started testing things and getting numbers that look nothing like the manual's
-my numbers were: 1000 for R-B/W and around 480 for R to each of the Y as well as B/W to each of the
Y
-additionally the multimeter would only register a reading in one direction so I could not reverse the
probes as suggested in the manual's chart.

Here's where I think I blew it.

Along the way towards figuring out what to test, I connected the two male pins inside the black coupler and got a small spark.

After putting everything back together to call it a night, I turned the key to "on," and now there is no power whatsoever. Nothing. I tested the voltage at the battery, still 12.4.

Did I fry something in the electrical system? Am I overlooking something? What do I not know about testing diodes?

Guess this is a learning opportunity.



Thanks again for looking this over, any advice is hugely appreciated,

Brandon



http://s15.postimg.org/grh76hcpj/stator_coupler.jpg (http://postimg.org/image/grh76hcpj/)

[JohnC]

There should be a main fuse on the starter solenoid. Sounds like you popped it.

Your voltage reading (13.4 volts reved up) sounds fine. a little higher wouldn't hurt, but that's plenty to charge the battery, unless you tested it with the sub woofer turned off... ;)

[n9643750]

Found that fuse! Thanks, there was even a spare in the same compartment.

[plato1]

Hi,

I have an 07' also and had the same issue awhile back. I had intermittent starting problems, went through a couple of batteries (by the way, Cycle gear has our battery which they sell as their brand and they offer a lifetime warranty--it's about $20 more than the regular one but well worth it--I even asked them if I blew the battery up and brought them pieces would they replace it and they said yes--they also told me they have stores across the nation and put you in the computer so you can get a new one anywhere while you may be traveling).....anyone here's what turned out to be the problem.....

The problem for me was in the start button---open it up and this is a little spring and contact which completes the connection when pushed. Clean the contacts off real good.....They also sell some contact spray--I don't remember the name as my friend has some and sprayed it on the contact---This solved the problem--which was at least a year ago--and I had had no issues since.....Check this out before buying expensive parts.....I hope this helps.... :)

[alantf]

You may not even have to open any switches up. I just blast into the switches/safety switches with aerosol contact cleaner, then work the switch a few times, and blast again. It always seems to work for me.

[n9643750]

Thanks for looking guys. It seems like since the bike started right up with a jump that we are looking at a low battery situation. If it was being drained by a switch, wouldn't that show up in the current leak test?

[alantf]

With a bad switch, it either works or it doesn't. Nothing to do with drain. It's just that switches not working are a fact of life with the GZ. Better get a can of contact cleaner, along with the can of carb cleaner, that you need to buy. I agree that it's most likely a bad battery.

[n9643750]

Excellent, thank you.

I'm going to to take the battery down to an autoparts store today for a voltage drop test. I'll pick up some carb and contact cleaners while I'm there. I hate buying a new battery without knowing what went wrong with the old one, but I guess I'll just make sure it's installed correctly.

I scratched the damn tank during this process too. Any advice for removing a decently deep one? I'm not sure how to tell if its through the clearcoat and into the color, but it will catch my fingernail pretty well.

[n9643750]

Well, the battery seems to be good. The auto parts store reports that it reads 115 cold cranking amps. I am confused about what else could be the issue.

[Water Warrior 2]

To prevent future scratches just put an old towel over the tank.

[jonathan180iq]

Well, the battery seems to be good. The auto parts store reports that it reads 115 cold cranking amps. I am confused about what else could be the issue.

After you said you found the fuse, and even had a spare, did that temporarily solve the problem? If it worked for a second and then you had a dead situation again, then you have a short somewhere you need to track down. If it didn't change anything, then I would agree that you have a contact problem on the starter switch. Even more rare is a contact issue between the key in the ignition.

Do this:
Take a non-running car and hook up the battery to your bike. If you can turn it over with the NON_RUNNING car battery, then the issue is your battery, regardless of what the battery test told you.

If you still get a non-cranking/running scenario, then the issue is either in the fuse, the switch, or the wiring harness (the latter of those being the rarest.)

[n9643750]

Hi Jonathon, thanks for your time. After I replaced the fuse the bike came back to life. I put the battery on the trickle charger last night and it started the bike no problem this morning. I'm going to take it on a ride this afternoon and see if it gets recharged.

[jonathan180iq]

Did you take it immediately off the charger and then start the bike?

If so, it's still possible that it's taking the charge but it's not keeping it.
Make sure you take it on a longer ride (30+ minutes) and don't turn it off unless you absolutely have to. After you get back home. Shut it down completely and then see if it will restart. If it does, then that's a good thing. Go inside, make yourself some dinner, and then come out and try to start it again. If it doesn't fire right up, then replace the battery.

[Water Warrior 2]

Did you take it immediately off the charger and then start the bike?

If so, it's still possible that it's taking the charge but it's not keeping it.
Make sure you take it on a longer ride (30+ minutes) and don't turn it off unless you absolutely have to. After you get back home. Shut it down completely and then see if it will restart. If it does, then that's a good thing. Go inside, make yourself some dinner, and then come out and try to start it again. If it doesn't fire right up, then replace the battery.

Sounds like a good plan to me. Also remember a new battery must first be fully charged before putting it into service. If not it will have a short service life.
A trickle charger of 2 amps over night will do the deed. I have also had good results with a Battery Tender over a looong night(12 to 14 hours).

[JohnC]

A simple, crude test of the charging system is to watch the headlight as you rev the engine just off idle. If it gets brighter your charging system is probably OK.

[jonathan180iq]

A simple, crude test of the charging system is to watch the headlight as you rev the engine just off idle. If it gets brighter your charging system is probably OK.
+1

[Meme]

Plato1, do you have a part # for that battery? I'm not finding it on their site, and my battery is slowly giving up.

Hi,
I have an 07' also and had the same issue awhile back. I had intermittent starting problems, went through a couple of batteries (by the way, Cycle gear has our battery which they sell as their brand and they offer a lifetime warranty--it's about $20 more than the regular one but well worth it--I even asked them if I blew the battery up and brought them pieces would they replace it and they said yes--they also told me they have stores across the nation and put you in the computer so you can get a new one anywhere while you may be traveling).....anyone here's what turned out to be the problem.....

The problem for me was in the start button---open it up and this is a little spring and contact which completes the connection when pushed. Clean the contacts off real good.....They also sell some contact spray--I don't remember the name as my friend has some and sprayed it on the contact---This solved the problem--which was at least a year ago--and I had had no issues since.....Check this out before buying expensive parts.....I hope this helps.... :)

[jonathan180iq]

Hey meme,

http://www.copypress.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/yo-dawg-i-heard-you-like-memes-so-we-put-a-meme-on-your-meme-about-your-meme-while-we-meme.jpg

[Water Warrior 2]

No part number needed. Just go to Wally World and buy one. They will have a battery application booklet or chart. Charge the battery fully before putting it in service.

[JohnC]

The original battery is FTX7L-BS

[Meme]

Thanks guys for the info, but I want the lifetime warranty one from Cycle Gear that plato1 mentioned. I have put two batteries in it over the last 7 years. This will be the third. A lifetime warranty will be nice. :2tup:

[JohnC]

I have put two batteries in it over the last 7 years. This will be the third.

That's about right for flooded lead acid batteries.

[n9643750]

Thanks again for all the help here,


I think I've solved the problem!

After running through all of the components of the charging system one by one and feeling confounded when they all seemed good, I noticed that the bolts holding the battery leads to the terminals were bottoming out and not enforcing a tight connection. I installed a couple of flat washers on each side, snugged the leads up, and the battery has been charging fully ever since.

[jonathan180iq]

Hahahaha. Awesome.

Like WW always says, K.I.S.S.