Bike won't start

[mgherman]

Tried to start the 2003 GZ yesterday. Last time I started is was 2 weeks ago. Won't start, the battery was dead. I charged it, then I tap the honk, the honk was working. Still it won't start. After few failed attemps it started, then shut it off, tried to start again, but won't start.
I checked the battery connections-they are clean and free of corrosion and are on tightly.
Next step is buying a new battery, but still the starting issue is not solved.
Could be a faulty contact. I am thinking of buying a new starter switch.

Any help is appreciated.
Thank you.

[JWR]

Try this, use the red kill switch a couple of times.
Rock it back and forth, then try to crank the bike again.
Remember the GZ can turn over good and not crank, it must turn over 100 percent fast.
Hook jumper cables to a non running auto and try.

It is usually the simple things, not the starter.

[mgherman]

Thanks, I'll try that.

[jonathan180iq]

When you say that it won't start, do you mean that it won't even turn over the engine, or that it's just won't stay running?

After a long break, I resorted to a rolling start just to get the gas flowing again. Varnish on these carbs is an issue if you don't ride very much or use a semi-consistent fuel cleaner. Use some carb cleaner regardless.

If you need more juice to get it fired up, boost it off of a NON-RUNNING car or something else. That should give you a few more tries to get it to crank and then immediately take it out for a spin and stretch her legs again.

[Water Warrior 2]

I'm still trying to figure out why Lynda's GZ could sit parked all winter and start right up after priming and run like a champ. Wasn't using fuel stabalizer either. Just made sure the battery was charged up.

[jonathan180iq]

Did you drain the carb before storage?

[mgherman]

jonathan,
it won't turn over the engine. I checked the battery connections, charged the battery (the honk is working), all seems to be fine, but still nothing. It has half a tank gas, the fuel vale is on.
I'm thinking it might be the starter button, it doesn't respond when I hit the button.

Thank you.

[mgherman]

Just bought it 3 weeks ago, it was starting fine. I did not clean the carb or drain the gas fom the tank. At some point when I shut off the engine I tried to start it again, but it wouldn't start. The previous owner told me that the battery was the problem, I pushed it, then it started. So I charged the battery and still won't start.

[jonathan180iq]

Ok, that narrows down what we are looking for.
If you can roll start the bike, you know it fires and mechanically it should be fine.

The kill switches on these bikes are known to wear down and lose contact. If you feel mechanically inclined, you can pull the housing apart and clean the switch plates. This would also give you an opportunity to check the starter button, though the kill switch it more common. You should be able to test voltage at the starter motor itself, if you feel like the switch is working. I haven't had this bike in quite some time, but there have to be some leads to can slap a voltmeter on to and see if it's getting juice.

There are only two known instances on the motors crapping out or of the starting gear blowing itself up. So you should be able to track this down fairly easily.

If you pull apart the kill switch housing, be cognizant of any little springs that may be in there. I don't recall that there are... only the throttle cable guides, I think. But someone with a better memory would have to verify.

[Water Warrior 2]

I'd bet money on the starter button having a spring just waiting to pop out. The kill switch is a likely candidate too.

[jonathan180iq]

You could also just shoot the switch with some WD-40, wiggle it like a snaggle tooth and pray for the best. ;)

[Water Warrior 2]

You could also just shoot the switch with some WD-40, wiggle it like a snaggle tooth and pray for the best. ;)
A little contact cleaner if some is handy might be better but either product would be easier than taking a housing apart and risking a spring explosion. Keep it simple and see how it works.

[mrlmd1]

You said you charged the battery but that doesn't mean anything. We don't know what you did to charge it. what you used, what the battery voltage was when you started and then finished, what is was 6-12 hours later. You every easily could have a dead battery.

Could you measure the battery voltage at the terminals at rest with everything off, and then when you go to start it, and let us know what they read. If you don't have a voltmeter or multimeter, then go buy one for as little as $4-5 because you will always use it.
The headlight and horn may work but the voltage may be too low to turn over the starter.
Do you hear the starter solenoid clicking or any noise when you go to start the bike?
And of course the clutch handle is pulled in when you go to start it, right?

Did you ever try and start it by connecting with jumper cables to a good 12 V battery, like in a NON-RUNNING car? You never answered that question or suggestion.

Do these first before you go out and buy all kinds of stuff that may not be needed. You have to start at the beginning and see if you have a good source of 12.8 V electrical power before working your way down the line and wasting your time and energy and money.

[Water Warrior 2]

Did you drain the carb before storage?
Nope. Lynda just shut it off as normal after a ride and let the bike sit. Just made sure the carb was primed for the first ride in the spring. Also worked the clutch a few times to loosen up the clutch plates and it was good to go with an extra 4 or 5 seconds on the starter.
I honestly expected the bike to balk and run like junk for a while but Lynda never had a complaint with the first spring ride.

I would and do suggest to everyone to use fuel stabilizer when storing a bike though. The benefits far outweigh the price of the product and I feel it helped with Lynda's M-50 that we just sold. The bike sat from last April until 3 or 4 weeks ago and was never started. It did have a full tank with stabilizer and started with a short push of the button. No sputtering or stalling either.
I did have a conversation with the new owner recently and he is more than pleased with the bike. I could hear him grinning over the phone.

[jonathan180iq]

That's awesome. I've actually become friends with the person who bought my last bike. He would periodically call or text me from time to time over the last year when little issues would come up. And seeing as how it was a Chinese bike, no one else really had any quick knowledge to give the guy. Plus, he was a little younger and it was his first bike ever, so I had no problem obliging him.

You just don't get that kind of camaraderie with cars... I've not once spoken to someone who bought a car from me, and I've sold quite a few. The bike scene is just more personal.

[mrlmd1]

Nice going Jonathan. You sold an unsuspecting, trusting newbie a defective bike? And then had a guilty conscience so you kept talking to him and advising him so he could keep it going a little while longer? (J/K, but you know that). :poke2:

And mgherman - any results from measuring battery voltage and the other things I asked you to do?

[jonathan180iq]

Haha... Going back over what I wrote, it DOES kinda look like that...

http://juliekenner.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/dr-evil.jpg

[mgherman]

mrlmd1-sorry for the late relpy. I used a battery charger from a friend of mine. When I started charging it, the display wouldn't show anything and then when finished it (could be wrong) was around 2-3.
Don't have a voltmeter or multimeter, have to buy one.
No, there isn't any noise when I go to start the bike. The clutch handle is pulled in when I tried to start it.
Have to try by connecting with jumper cables to a 12 V battery.

Thank you for the advice.
I'll let you know after I'll try all of the above.

[bmxr123]

If there is not even a "click" from the starter solenoid but your bike lights up then you are looking at a break in the ignition circuit. QD (CNC) electronics cleaner is your friend.

Assuming all fused connections have been checked and battery leads are tight:

-Remove the kickstand switch and spray inside while pressing and releasing the switch.Do this until you once again feel the definitive "metal on metal" feeling.
-Disassemble the starter switch and get both the starter button AND the kill/run switch clean (with QD cleaner and a small carb brush or something similar)
-Clean the clutch safety switch plug and its contacts(found at left switch / clutch handle area) Or just connect a 1/2 inch wire to each end of the harness-side of the plug as a temporary "test-mode" method.
-Clean and check neutral indicator switch (behind the front sprocket cover).
-Disconnect the plug on the starter solenoid and clean the contacts on both sides. Take out the 20amp fuse in the solenoid and spray some cleaner while working that fuse in and out a few times.



I have brought a lot of back to life with the above steps. I usually do this without even breaking out the multimeter, as it shouldn't take more the 45 minutes to cover all your bases anyways.

The GZ250 i recently worked on had Co-existing issues found in both the kill/run switch(oxidation) and the kickstand switch(road grime/chain grease inside of the switch that you could feel and hear!). The bike would not start and run properly until BOTH of these issues were addressed.


Electrical issues can be so discouraging but they can be made easy if you are prepared(with QD cleaner and a small brush set) and thorough. Not all continuity issues can be solved with a can of cleaner and a brush, but while clicking the "buy it now" button you can at least say you tried! In all seriousness though, cleaning the electrical parts associated with the ignition circuit USUALLY works. hehe

[mrlmd1]

All of the above is fine but if you don't have a fully charged battery to start with, you are wasting all of your time.

Like I said before, first check the battery voltage.

If it's low (12.8 V is fully charged), then hook the battery up with jumper cables to a NON-RUNNING car and try to start it.

If then nothing happens, then have at all the electrical connections and safety switches. etc., 'till you find the problem.

I don't know how many times this has to be repeated -- You must start at the beginning and work down the line to find the problem. Any problem. There is a stepwise procedure or order to follow instead of a shotgun approach where if you get lucky you may fix it but you have no idea what was wrong.
There's no sense in digging into the electrical system if your battery is dead, so start there.

[bmxr123]

The OP said he didn't have a multimeter. I was just offering what i thought could be a "safe" conclusion to jump to...I mean, if its only been two weeks and he doesn't even hear the starter relay clicking(signifies lower than sufficient voltage).....

But yeah, you are right. Definately check voltage across the terminals to eliminate that variable first.

[mgherman]

Thanks for the insights mrlmd1 and bmxr123. I was able to start it yesterday evening after I sprayed WD-40 to the kill/run switch and start button. But I will check the battery voltage anyway.

[jonathan180iq]

If the switch was the problem and she fired right up, your battery is good. Take her out and stretch her legs!
Congrats!

[bmxr123]

Cool beans!

I'm glad my first appearance could be a worthy one!

by the way: Jonathan, that crazy Baliwood gif sequence is awesome..I miss the impracticality of "Old Hollywood"

[jonathan180iq]

Isn't it the coolest thing ever? They are so insanely ridiculous that they become quality classics.

[bmxr123]

Yeah, definately cult-classic material! What is the movie title? I wanna see it at higher frame rate.

[bmxr123]

nevermind...found it..its from "SINGHAM" aaand i'm downloading it.

[mrlmd1]

Glad it's working but just another word. WD40 may have worked but it's not recommended for that. It is not an electrical contact cleaner and will leave a residue on the surface when it dries and may not prevent your problem from recurring when you least expect it. Get some electrical contact cleaner and work the switch on and off numerous times to really clean of the innards of that switch. You may need that stuff for other uses on the bike and around the house anyway in the future so it's not a bad thing to have around.
Check the battery voltage at rest anyway, then start it up and rev it to 2500-3500 rpms at least (estimate by ear, just rev it up) and measure the voltage. If the battery is OK you should get 12.6-12.8 V at rest if it's fully charged, and 13.5-14.5 V revved up if the charging system is working OK. There is no significant, if any, charging at idle, it has to be revved up. Best way to charge the battery is to ride it for at least a half hour.

[mgherman]

Measured the battery voltage is now showing 12.6 V, it starts and runs well.Bought an electrical contact cleaner spray can just in case I will encounter other electrical issues.
mrlmd1 thanks again for all your help.

[jonathan180iq]

http://ircimg.net/mexican-guy-thumbs-up.jpg
For Resolution

[cnieves09]

https://youtu.be/z7faM8SUAVQ I fix the issue after trying the switches

[Water Warrior 2]

First time we have seen this kind of problem due to the chain. Thank you for sharing and pointing out a potential problem for other riders. :tup: