Target fixation, rain and failure to negotiate a curve :(

[greatmaul]

I never really thought target fixation would happen to me, but it sure did, and yes I have Proficient Motorcycling by David L. Hough (and his 2 other books, and 7 or 8 others.)

I think multiple factors went into this *almost* crash. 1.) I was dead tired because it was Thanksgiving and we had to get up early (I work nights.) 2.) we were late, 3.) my wife and kids were somewhere in the car and I was trying to catch up, and 4.) it was the very first time I had ridden in the rain.

I was super nervous about the rain, and I came up on a 45mph left hander, and was easing around it when I noticed I was angled towards the side of the road. I tried to correct the steering but one hand was fighting the other: the left hand wanted to lean to make the curve, and the right was fighting desperately to keep the bike straight up and down because the street was wet. I was panicking and staring right at the edge of the road, so I watched myself drift right to the line, over it, and right off the road.

It was all dirt and rocks and tree roots, and I kept rolling. I didn't drift any further sideways I think because I was afraid to look over there because it was all trees and barbed wire fence. After a long bit of panicked trying to stay upright, I realized I still had the throttle on, so I eased off of it, and after I finally slowed, I angled back on to the road.

I was really amazingly surprised that I didn't go down, and for a bit I swore I'd never ride again, but that was last week and I've been riding to work and back with no problems. I'm just afraid of what will happen next time when it rains.

[Gz Rider]

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[Water Warrior 2]

Sounds like a valueable lesson learned with no bloodshed. Glad to hear you didn't loose control and crash. I have purposely tried target fixation as an experiment..............sounds dumb but I was curious about a couple things. Sure enough I did learn a lesson. Even if you know about target fixation it is really hard to break out of it once the eyes are locked on to a target. Scared myself enough to break into a cold sweat. Didn't leave the road but it was a close call.

[JWR]

The more you ride, the more you will trust the bike and tires.

Most times when you don't trust the bike the to go where you want, you look for an escape route.

I have a talk with myself every time I ride to keep my head in the game.

[Water Warrior 2]

The more you ride, the more you will trust the bike and tires.
Excellant statement with only one flaw in it. You have to know how to ride properly first or you just get more terrified and freeze up with each ride. Sounds like a great reason for riding lessons from an experienced instructor.

[Gz Rider]

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[Water Warrior 2]

Another point here is that the GZ can be forgiving of mistakes like this. Imagine that situation with 2-3 hundered more pounds of bike.
Bigger is not always better. Developing your riding skills on a smaller bike is probably a good thing for 99% of new riders.

[greatmaul]

I have a talk with myself every time I ride to keep my head in the game.
That's a very good idea. I'll definitely do that. I think a big part of the problem I had was that I was not concentrating on riding but on other things.

Sounds like a great reason for riding lessons from an experienced instructor. good point! I've had the MSF class and was actually hoping it would be raining then, because I've heard that if you take the basic rider course in the rain it helps teach you not to be afraid of and over-react to the rain. Maybe I should sign up for the ERC. I do have a couple thousand miles under my belt.

Thanks everyone for the good thoughts and wishes. Much appreciated!

[JWR]

The only real problem is visibility. The bike will usually handle beyond our ability to ride it.

On my Blue Ridge trip, we rode over 400 miles of rain and fog. Granted we were not on city streets where we had to look out for red lights and such.

[JWR]

This picture is after the fog had cleared enough to resume riding.
That is Ed with a yellow rain jacket at the end of the pull off.

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-sJMx3tMsmrM/SpMV37I9viI/AAAAAAAAAaU/2sr9xO3wcAs/s640/Blue%252520ridge%252520073.JPG

[Gz Rider]

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[greatmaul]

This picture is after the fog had cleared enough to resume riding.
That is Ed with a yellow rain jacket at the end of the pull off.

wow! I can actually barely make out a yellow jacket there. Can't imagine what it was like *before* it cleared up. Thanks for the advice on rain riding. I just have to trust the bike and the tires. So far they've always been more than up to the task!

[Water Warrior 2]

This picture is after the fog had cleared enough to resume riding.
That is Ed with a yellow rain jacket at the end of the pull off.

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-sJMx3tMsmrM/SpMV37I9viI/AAAAAAAAAaU/2sr9xO3wcAs/s640/Blue%252520ridge%252520073.JPG
That is just plain frightening.

[Water Warrior 2]

The bike will usually handle beyond our ability to ride it.
No truer words have been spoken. I "thought" I had a good handle on the Vstrom in the twisties. Then I changed my riding position and used more body english in curves. I was very surprised how much more speed I could maintain and never feel that the bike was reaching it's limits. But I did find my limits. I won't be going there again any time soon. But it was fun while it lasted.

[JWR]

The tires that I am running now have a 50 degree lean angle in the dry and 41 in the wet.

More than enough for an old and slow rider.

[greatmaul]

The tires that I am running now have a 50 degree lean angle in the dry and 41 in the wet. More than enough for an old and slow rider.

wow, you can look stuff like that up?? I had no idea. I'm going to look for my tires. It might give me a bit more confidence. I thought I was shooting for maybe a 10 or 15 degree lean as max in the rain.

[JWR]

Interesting read.

Sometimes the motorcycle tire makers will give a maximum lean angle for a particular tire. For instance, in May 2009 Michelin claims a maximum lean angle of 50.6 degrees on dry pavement and 41.9 degrees on wet pavement "as measured at the Michelin test track" for their Pilot Power sportbike tires. One might guess that the Michelin test track's pavement has less sand and better maintenance than standard street pavement, but that's purely a guess. In any case, that gives a coefficient of friction of 1.2 on dry pavement and .90 on wet pavement.

BMW's S1000RR sportbike has a traction-control mechanism which measures lean angle and restricts power when the angle exceeds a predetermined limit. Rain mode allows 38 degrees of lean, corresponding to a coefficient of friction of .78; sport mode allows 45 degrees, ? = 1; race mode allows 48 degrees, ? = 1.1; and slick mode gives 53 degrees, ? = 1.3

[Water Warrior 2]

Modern Research and Design sure beats the old Trial by Error method.

[mole2]

Modern Research and Design sure beats the old Trial by Error method.

Except when it breaks and the rider has never developed the skills to deal with it.


:)

[Way]

I have a talk with myself every time I ride to keep my head in the game.
That's a very good idea. I'll definitely do that. I think a big part of the problem I had was that I was not concentrating on riding but on other things.

Sounds like a great reason for riding lessons from an experienced instructor. good point! I've had the MSF class and was actually hoping it would be raining then, because I've heard that if you take the basic rider course in the rain it helps teach you not to be afraid of and over-react to the rain. Maybe I should sign up for the ERC. I do have a couple thousand miles under my belt.

Thanks everyone for the good thoughts and wishes. Much appreciated!

Even though I've passed the motorcycle license course and have my endorsement, I still do slow speed maneuvers every now and then in season just to keep sharp. It's also kind of fun. Might help you as well to keep in touch with the bike. I plan on more when Spring comes around too.

[Water Warrior 2]

Keeping in touch with bike and practicing is the best way to avoid an oops. Years ago a good friend of mine was on a first ride in the spring. Somebody yelled "Do a wheelie." He was an excellant rider but the winter rest period overwhelmed his reflexes. 18 months later he was finally off his crutches. That was a lesson learned the hard way.

[Water Warrior 2]

Just read this elsewhere. Target Fixation: looking at what you are afraid to hit.

[greatmaul]

Just read this elsewhere. Target Fixation: looking at what you are afraid to hit.

Exactly. Same thing happened last night just for an instant. I was going a tiny bit wide on a right hand curve and in a moment of fear I looked at the guardrail on the opposite side of the road. In just that brief moment I realized that not only was I looking at it, but I was now heading for it, so I quickly switched my mindset, looked into the turn and made it effortlessly. I never even left my own lane. I'm really glad I realized what was happening and fixed it right away.

In the "Ride Like A Pro" video, the Motorman shows this repeatedly... that even if you're trying to do a u-turn for the riding test, if you look at the white line even for a second to see if you're going to hit it, in that second your path changes to drive right towards it and you end up not having enough room to make the turn.

[Water Warrior 2]

Looking at the white line means you are looking down. Looking down is the last thing you want to do while doing slow parking lot practice. With practice a rider knows where the wheels are and never needs to look down. You will ride safer and smoother with a lot less pucker moments.
Riding over pavement cracks or railroad tracks is a good way to learn where the front and rear wheels are without breaking the overall view of the street. Once you can feel the size of the bike and it's length things get a lot easier and safer.
In a related thought, ever see a person who can't manuever a cage. Simple remedy. Walk around it before you drive it. Get to know it's size. Look at the front/rear overhang and remember it. Look for RR tracks just like a bike rider will to judge the wheel base.

[greatmaul]

That's a good point. I haven't really got the feel for the whole size of the bike and where the wheels are at all times, but I get your example of how really checking out a car's size can make it so much easier to maneuver.

[JWR]

greatmaul, I am going to give you a drill to use.

Use your head like a turn signal, but to set it in motion, lift your head up, then down to level, then turn your head into the corner.

If you are in S curves do it again to cancel the right turn , then your head and eyes are already up and level to go the other way.

Do this off the bike, while in the car, anywhere you can practice.
I promise this will make your brain work with your action much better.

Motion=reaction...

If it don't work for you, please come back and tell me.

[Water Warrior 2]

Sounds like good drill. Gonna try it tomorrow while truckin around.

[greatmaul]

greatmaul, I am going to give you a drill to use. Use your head like a turn signal, but to set it in motion, lift your head up, then down to level, then turn your head into the corner.
I promise this will make your brain work with your action much better.


That sounds great JWR, I'll start doing that. I can see how that will definitely help make the head turn a completely automatic part of turning.

[JWR]

One thing I forgot. Look between your shield and mirror.

[greatmaul]

Ok, I've tried it and I like it! I noticed that I tend to look where something is interesting. Usually, it's where I"m going, like through the curve, but if I see something scary, like a big rusty metal guardrail on a rain slicked road, I tend to look at that and the bike goes there. When using the head turn signal drill, I'm forced to ignore whatever might be interesting (rabbit, side of the road, big truck) and look through the turn. That helps me actually make the turn so I don't have to worry about said truck.

Not that I'm completely ignoring a truck or a rabbit, I'm just not looking at it while I'm trying to negotiate a curve. If it drifts into my lane, even more reason not to stare at it, but to instead stare at where the escape route is.

before this, since I usually look through the turn anyway, I thought that was good enough, but now I know I wasn't looking by habit, but because I was interested in it. I want the head turn to be an absolutely automatic, unbreakable habit. Thank you for helping me with this.

[greatmaul]

Ok, another question.

I've been reading a lot about target fixation, because I really don't like the feeling that I can't control myself or the motorcycle, and one person, in all the dozens of posts I've read, even in other forums, said one thing that no one else said.

He said that when we target fixate, we panic and forget to countersteer.

And that kind of made sense to me? All the while when I was watching the bike drift towards that line, I was trying desperately to turn the bike, but it wouldn't turn. I think that I was trying to steer the wheel left, away from the line, and it was making me go right, towards the line, so I kept straightening the wheel. Turn, straight, turn, straight, etc, and this was what I felt the whole time, like one arm was fighting the other.

Has anyone heard of this? He said you basically have to shout in your head, "Push Left!" for example if you want to go left and if your body is trying to turn the wheel towards the left to escape danger.

[JWR]

Ok,


He said that when we target fixate, we panic and forget to countersteer.

All the while when I was watching the bike drift towards that line, I was trying desperately to turn the bike, but it wouldn't turn.



i think that you were looking and thinking "Damn that's going to hurt".
So the bike was going exactly where your eyes were telling it to go.

BTDT. Got the T-shirt(scars).

[Water Warrior 2]

The KEY to survival is to "LOOK" where you want to go. Keep your head up and your body will do the rest. The further you look through a curve is an opportunity to set up the bike for a nice even path of travel. This will also allow a speed adjustment if visibility is limited. When Lynda still had her GZ I would follow her through curves and her skill level was poetry in motion.