electric motorcycles are coming to the USA

[ecr959]

Read this great story (with pictures) about the new bikes that are here in a few years. Some are here already.

http://www.txchnologist.com/2011/the-ta ... motorcycle (http://www.txchnologist.com/2011/the-take-who-holds-back-the-electric-motorcycle)

[Skunkhome]

138 Million on the road by 2017? It is true that you can get real tire burning performance out of some battery powered vehicles but I'm sorry, I just don't see that happening at the state of the technology available today and in the near future. You would think that it would not take much to impress a guy who rides a GZ250 but I don't want to have to put down $40K+ to get a bike that will have enough range to take me on a 4 hour tour on Sunday afternoon. And $10K for a bike that quits after a "very respectable" 57 miles is not what I would think would be competitive in terms of performance or cost. I think the storage battery has come a long way in the last decade as I use cordless electric tools every day and rarely plug in a corded handheld tool. That said I don't go to a job with only one power pack hoping it will last till I am done. I keep pretty good track of my battery usage and know that the performance I get from one today is not what I am going to get under identical conditions 8 months from now. Also the performance of any given battery will vary from day to day depending on the temperature at the time it was charged and discharged. Have you ever noticed how your cell phone most days can operate most of the day and keep the battery above 50% then in a matter of an hour or so be useless for anything other than a paperweight. A dead cell Phone is usually nothing more than an annoyance but a vehicle that you are relying on to get you from point "A" to Point "B" can be a real life threatening problem when it when it quits at point "B minus 10 miles". I can see some with nothing better to do with their money buying them for the novelty but I just don't see them making any serious inroads into the riding community for some time to come.

[Water Warrior 2]

All of the tree huggers and environmentalists tend to have a very narrow view of the world as it really exists. Look at all the newer cars and trucks that are available to the consumer that are very fuel efficient, well built and cheap to buy. They get cleaner every new model year and still retain excellant reliablility. Compare that to the resources it takes to build an electric car or bike and do the math and environmental impact. Gas powered vehicles are still the cheapest way to go. Toyota is the only manufacturer to make a half decent hybrid and they only become cost effective in cab service or a delivery service.
Take aim at industry that pollutes the environment and makes large profits with no concern for tomorrow. Look at coal burning power plants that provide power for electric cars. Something is wrong in this picture.

[jonathan180iq]

Well, the appeal of the electric vehicle is not that it is initially cheaper to build or that the cost to the consumer when purchasing is cheaper, it's that the electric motor is a more efficient machine than the ICE and there are never any associated refueling costs., aside from battery replacement when the time comes.

Those are pretty big difference makes when you compare the two propulsion methods side by side.
The problem with the way we implement the idea behind an electric or a hybrid is that we have to see it to a consumer base that, and rightly so, can get a comparable vehicle for much less if they just get a ICE vehicle.

Like you said, why pay for a hybrid Prius which will get 40+mpg when you can get a new Ford Fiesta for less money and it also gets 40+mpg and has 4 doors? Just so you have the Hybrid badge on the back? (Which is what some people do.)

The argument behind coal fired plants making the electricity to charge electric vehicles is valid, to a point. There are also plenty of plants across the country that are not coal based. I would bet that just about every single power coop in the country has some type of solar power and wind power array also feeding into the system. And most places are doing research into methane recapture and all other types of more efficient and cleaner ways of producing electricity. Down here, TVA has dam power, Nuclear, Coal, Solar, Wind & some other bio stuff. The last three are not as high on the priority list as I would like them to be but the main source of juice comes from all of the dams and the Nuclear facilities, not from coal.

It's just a trade off. Let's replace all vehicles with electric, hypothetically. That would place a must greater strain on the power grid, sure. But it would also be an unimaginable amount of gasoline that was not being burned. Trucks and trains and all kids of tankers that don't have to cross oceans and landscapes and interstates to deliver the gasoline. And consumers can also get their own solar charging stations for their homes or use them strictly for vehicles.

I'm more impressed with the option of simply having choice when it comes to making my car drive from here to there. I can run that car on coal, sure. Or I could run it on Solar... or I could run it on my homemade hydro-electric water wheel that I set up in the creek down by the house (Not really, just throwing it out there.) There are options with electrics that just don't exist in the ICE world that relies solely on petroleum.

[Skunkhome]

Now I have I heard of putting coils in the road bed that would recharge the batteries as the vehicle is rolling over the pavement. This in theory sounds very promising but is I believe many years off in the future. I am sure that if such were attempted there would be an out cry about the radiation emitted from such a system. The big concern that most people have beyond the initial cost is the lack of realistic range before recharging is required. With the present technology the answer is on board charging such as a hybrid which still requires hydrocarbon fuel.

[jonathan180iq]

All of those ideas about charging roads and things like that would work great in a planned community or in an up-start developing country. But in places like the US, where one medium already has such a strong hold, it's just a pipe dream.

Why tear up perfectly good roads to lay down charging tracks when there is no electric vehicle market? If the consumer completely changes their mind and decides that noone is ever going to drive an ICE vehicle again, then that's a different story but that's something that simply isn't going to happen.

[Water Warrior 2]

I'd like to see modern tech take a fancy to a modern steam car. It wouldn't take a lot of keroseneor heating oil to heat water and create lots and lots of steam. Yeah, check the oil and fill er up with the garden hose. :2tup:

[jonathan180iq]

Me too.
But, personally, the compressed air car is much more appealing, since the only by product is.... air.

http://im.rediff.com/money/2007/mar/21mlook1.jpg

[Water Warrior 2]

Me too.
But, personally, the compressed air car is much more appealing, since the only by product is.... air.

http://im.rediff.com/money/2007/mar/21mlook1.jpg
Cool little run about. Don't know anything about the compressed air motors but wouldn't they have a limited range like all electric cars ??

[jonathan180iq]

They have these gigantic carbon fibre air tanks under the car that give a range close to 300 miles per fill up. With a home compressor, IIRC, it takes like 2 hours to fill them up. With an industrial compressor it's something like 2-3 minutes.

The motor is a little rotary looking thing that only requires a little bit of lube to keep it going. So there would still be oil changes but they wouldn't be nearly as common as on an ICE. But no pollutants and no having to buy gas. It's an awesome solution but a lot of people are turned off by the looks and light weight design.

[Skunkhome]

I'd like to see modern tech take a fancy to a modern steam car. It wouldn't take a lot of keroseneor heating oil to heat water and create lots and lots of steam. Yeah, check the oil and fill er up with the garden hose. :2tup:
The idea is the same but they have come up with a closed system that heats "freon" that is 10 -12 times more reactive to heat than water and much heavier. It boils at lower temps and delivers far more energy to the piston than steam. As for the compressed air car... It has far less potential and mileage per liter than any other proposed energy sourse.

[Water Warrior 2]

Thanks guys. That is really quite fascinating. Now why doesn't the governments of our respective countries consider these alternatives ??.................................Oh yeah, they can't make any real money promoting something good for taxpayers.

[mrlmd1]

I would hate to be inside that and get hit by any other car, or even by a Goldwing!

[Skunkhome]

Well, MDI, made some claims in recent years that their compressed air car was capable of speeds of 68 mph for a distance of 80km but to this date they have not produced proof of those claims. The best anyone has been able to achieve in independent studies using MDI's specifications is a range of 7.22km per charge. The problem is that the energy density of compressed air even at 4500 psi is very low even in comparison to the most inefficient lead-acid batteries. Air power has been successfully used in service vehicles and platform trucks in plant operations where air supply points are readily available but still have not proven to be as effective as battery operated equipment. One major issue with compressed air is the tremendous amount of heat energy that is absorbed when the air expands. The air needs to be rewarmed with a heat exchanger to keep air pressure at an optimum level. The heat exchanger can serve as A/C in warm climates but would be ineffective in cold or even cool climates. Any moisture in the air will readily turn to ice and plug up airports and freeze up the motor. Since compressed air technology is cheap the vehicles would be inexpensive...with that being the case if it were viable for transportation we would already see them in every driveway IMO.

[Water Warrior 2]

A few years ago Chrysler Corp. was making big waves about their wonderful Natural Gas powered minivans. That was looking good until one was taken on a road trip. With very few refueling stations and it's rather sad range per fill it was a major exercise to get anywhere. It was towed a lot. Gotta love the mag writers who test these things for us.
Quite a number of years ago a friend of mine had a NG powered company pick-up. Would have been great if he only had to circle the block around the refueling station and didn't need to haul anything. Compressed NG tanks are big and heavy while the natural gas didn't pack the punch to really haul the weight around. My friend(Bob) had his own Dodge Ram running on Liquid Propane Gas which was a much better way to drive in his opinion. As a long range commuter the Ram excelled and was very cost effective compared to gasoline.

[greatmaul]

I saw a "Zero" motorcycle today in Sacramento. It looked rather well used, and it was noisier than I thought. Mostly just clanking, etc. no engine noise, of course. Was a dual sport style.

[Water Warrior 2]

The clanking might be a good thing. It give folks a heads up that something is coming. I have had quiet electric scooters zoom past me on the sidewalk and scare me half to death. They need a piece of cardboard sticking into the spokes to make some noise.

[Skunkhome]

The clanking might be a good thing. It give folks a heads up that something is coming. I have had quiet electric scooters zoom past me on the sidewalk and scare me half to death. They need a piece of cardboard sticking into the spokes to make some noise.playing cards and clothes pins as we used to do on bicycles as kids :)