Valves tapping...?

[ArizonaKev]

So I changed my oil and filter this weekend, put in a stock oild filter and some Valvoline 10W40 cycle specific oil. Made sure it was filled to the proper level and all. Funny thing is, today, riding home from work (when it was much hotter, i.e. 103 degrees) I noticed that it seemed to be tapping a little more than normal - what sounded to me like valves tapping.

My question is - is it normal for GZ's o sound like there is a little bit of tapping, simply because it is an overhead cam and we are so close to the motor? (I haven't ridden a bike for a number of years). I guess it seemed a little weird that it would actually be a little louder after having changed the oil and all. And I made sure it is filled to the right level, checked here and the service manual to be sure.

My bike has 13,000 miles on it, and I bought it about a month-and-a-half ago with 12,000 on it. It appeared to have been very well maintained. Am I being a little overly paranoid about this, or might it need a valve adjustment or something?

As always, all advice and tips are appreciated. Stay cool all - Lord knows I'm tryin'!


AZ Kev

[Water Warrior 2]

A little valve noise is okay. If you have the service record for the bike check to see if/when the valves were checked and/or adjusted. It is okay to be a little paranoid about noises. It shows you care about the bike and it's mechanical happiness.

[ArizonaKev]

Thanks WW. I don't actually have service records, but so far, everything I checked out or dug into has looked good, like someone had been maintaining it.

Seeing as how I just changed the oil, I think I will give it a few days and see if the sound stays the same or gets worse. I will probably call the shop I bought my filter at and see what they charge for a valve adjustment, or see if I can get a recommendtation for another place.

Thanks for the advice, and you're right - if it didn't bug me, that would be a much bigger issue, eh? Lol! Funny thing is, I think I love my bike as much as any Harley rider ever did. I have a feeling I will be riding it 'til the wheels fall off, at which point I will just get another one!

:2tup:

AZ Kev

[blaine]

A little valve noise is fine.The valves should be checked and or adjusted every 5000 kms.Be aware of valves that are too quiet,as they tighten when adjustment is needed.As you are hearing a little noise I wouldn't worry.
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[burkbuilds]

I'll second what blaine and the others are telling you. With my GZ, the valve noise was usually the greatest right after adjustment, and when it got quiet, it was usually time to adjust them again. I did mine about every 3,000 miles or so.

[Easy Rider]

My question is - is it normal for GZ's o sound like there is a little bit of tapping, simply because it is an overhead cam and we are so close to the motor?

Am I being a little overly paranoid about this, or might it need a valve adjustment or something?


Yes and yes and maybe. :biggrin:

Mine did that when it was new; louder valve noises when hot, that is; especially when re-started HOT. Then after 1000 mies or so, it quit doing that. Might have been about when they did a valve adjustment. Might have been right about the time I started using Mobil 1 Synthetic bike oil too; don't remember for sure.

If you don't know when the last valve check was done.......do it.......and then stop worrying. :cool:

[Easy Rider]

Be aware of valves that are too quiet,as they tighten when adjustment is needed.

I thought we discussed this before............

Whether the valves get tighter or looser between adjustments depends on which parts wear the fastest.

If the valve face and seat wears more, they get tighter. If the cam and valve stem wears faster, they get looser. If all the wear is even....then it's a draw.

You can't always predict which way they will go from one interval to another.

[dentheman]

You did put the filter in correctly, with the spring, etc? It doesn't seem right to me that there is suddenly a new noise being noticed when all you did was change the oil/filter.

[dhgeyer]

Hearing some valve noise is normal. You may just have started noticing it. I doubt that an oil change would make a difference, unless there was a heavier weight oil in it before you changed it. A heavier weight oil will quiet engine noise a bit.

Most manufacturers specify a range of acceptable clearance for valves, usually different for the intake and exhaust valves. If they move out of that range, it's generally better to have valves a little loose than a little tight. With greater clearance, the valve stays closed a little longer. If the valves clearances are too tight, they stay open too long. This is where trouble can happen, because the only way the valves have to cool down is by transferring heat to the valve seat when closed. So, if the valve clearances gets too tight, you can burn the valves. This applies mainly to the exhaust valves.

Loose valves make more noise, because the cam lobe is striking the valve more, as opposed to riding on it more if they're too tight. One mechanic I know likes to say "Loose valves are noisy valves but happy valves.". If they go too far out in either direction you start to see performance suffer.

The suggested valve adjustment interval on the GZ is 3000 miles, relatively short for a motorcycle. They tend to move more when new, and settle down after a while. After you've done a few checks with minimal or no adjustment required, I think you can stretch the interval out some. Of course, if you don't do it yourself, you won't know when that happens.

Shop mechanics will leave a valve alone if it's anywhere within spec. So you can come off of a fresh valve adjustment with a valve that's almost too tight, or almost too loose. If you do it yourself, you'll be more inclined to set them all where you want them as long as you're in there. I set mine on the loose side, but still within spec. As long as I keep hearing them, I know I'm OK.

If you don't know exactly when the last tune up was done, you should assume the worst and have it done. Or, better yet, learn to do it yourself and know it's done right and the valves pairs are consistent. It's not horribly difficult on the GZ.

[ArizonaKev]

Thanks for all the advice everyone. If anything, I take some comfort in knowing that it is probably more worrisome if their is little or no valve noise than if there is some. Also, someone mentioned something about it tapping more when it was hot, or after restarting hot, and that is exactly when I hear it.

I did make sure that I put the filter back in correctly, with the o-ring, spring and all. I also checked the level of the oil after filling it (put in 1.5 qts). I think it is probably more of a situation of actually taking notice of it where I simply hadn't before.

In any case, I will keep my eyes and ears open, and if I end up feeling more uncomfortable about it, or it starts sounding worse, I will get it checked out. There are no leaks, no smoke and performance and gas mileage or great. So I think for now, I will "let it ride".

Thanks a lot everyone - I really appreciate all your input. You guys (and gals) are the best :2tup:


AZ Kev

[alantf]

I also checked the level of the oil after filling it (put in 1.5 qts).

This is a metric bike, so buy yourself a metric measuring jug. It takes 1300 ml when doing an oil change, and 1400 ml when doing an oil and filter change. :2tup:

[Water Warrior 2]

Alantf. U.S. quart bottles have a clear vertical strip up one side that is marked off in fluid ounces and almost a liter marked in 100 ml graduations. But I do agree with a more specific measuring device. Had a 1 liter graduated cylinder that was excellent. For smaller quantities a person could use a baby bottle from a dollar store. For that matter, almost any marked container would be close enough for our purposes as we are not working on a nuclear reactor or shuttle craft.

[alantf]

Ah.. I thought he was trying to work out quarts to millilitres in his head. Quarts seems to be an American thing. I assume that a quart is two pints, same as in england, but in England we'd use pints not quarts. Then again, American gallons are different to English gallons, so American pints (and hence Quarts) will be different. :cry: It just seems easier, somehow, to go along with the original measurement. Like you, I had to go from miles to kilometers, then gallons to litres, then (on this site) from imperial gallons to American gallons. Just seems that life gets more complicated every day O_o

[ArizonaKev]

Ha ha ha!!! I like that WW - "we're not dealing with nuclear reactors or space shuttles" - good thing too!

I just went by what was in the manual, and it said 1400ml, or 1.5 US quarts. I have actually done a fair amount of maintenance on my own vehicles in the past, so I always fill to a little less than is recommended, start it up and let it warm up a bit, turn it off, let it settle, and recheck. Overfilling is no bueno, and can cause a lot of stress on seals and such.

Yeah, I think I got close enough using the see through strip WW spoke of - won't be using any graduated cylinders or beakers in the foreseeable future!!! :lol:

AZ Kev

[Water Warrior 2]

1.5 U.S. quarts........48 fluid ounces..........1420 ml..............but who really cares that much ?

Alantf, does the British pint equal 16 fluid ounces ??v How many fluid ounces in a British gallon ?

[alantf]

Yes there's 16 fluid ounces to the pint, & 8 pints to the gallon, so, as the American gallon is different to the English gallon, the pints must be different as well. :cry: I've also noticed that American recipes use "cups" whereas English recipes use ounces etc., so there must be a standard cup somewhere along the line. This is why I like to use whatever system the manufacturers state. It cuts out any mistakes, between each different country. :2tup:

[dhgeyer]

I agree with ArizonaKev's method. Fill with slightly less, go for a 15 or 20 minute ride, let it settle, then top it up. My reason is that I've observed minor differences in capacity even in bikes of the same model. My only caution would be to add just a little at a time when doing the final top up, and let each small addition settle for a few minutes, or you'll end up overfilling it anyway.

I've changed the oil on the GZ twice, and in this case I just went with the quart and a half, not using the above method. This left the oil slightly less than completely full, but that's OK, since the oil change interval is quite short and the bike doesn't use any to speak of.

[alantf]

Yes there's 16 fluid ounces to the pint

:blush: :blush: :blush: Oh Oh - My wife's just told me that there's TWENTY fluid ounces to a pint :blush: :blush: :blush: I must have got confused with ounces in a pound (old man shuffles off, muttering to himself!) :oops:

[burkbuilds]

Hey Alantf, I'm not sure about European/British measurements, but here in the US A gallon has 128 fluid oz (4 Quarts)and thus Each Quart is 32 fluid ozs and also is 2 pints, which means each Pint is 16 fluid ozs.

[alantf]

Hey Alantf, I'm not sure about European/British measurements, but here in the US A gallon has 128 fluid oz (4 Quarts)and thus Each Quart is 32 fluid ozs and also is 2 pints, which means each Pint is 16 fluid ozs.

That must be why English & American gallons are different. English 20 fluid ounces to a pint, American 16 fluid ounces to a pint.

I've just checked on the internet, to make sure I'm not getting confused again, & sure enough, English is 20 fl oz.

Just did a conversion check on the internet, as well. 1 US gall = 0.8327 Imp gall, & 16 divided by 20 = 0.8, so the figures seem to work out (almost) :)

[5th_bike]

Hey Alantf, I'm not sure about European/British measurements, but here in the US A gallon has 128 fluid oz (4 Quarts)and thus Each Quart is 32 fluid ozs and also is 2 pints, which means each Pint is 16 fluid ozs.

That must be why English & American gallons are different. English 20 fluid ounces to a pint, American 16 fluid ounces to a pint.

I've just checked on the internet, to make sure I'm not getting confused again, & sure enough, English is 20 fl oz.

Just did a conversion check on the internet, as well. 1 US gall = 0.8327 Imp gall, & 16 divided by 20 = 0.8, so the figures seem to work out (almost) :)

:lol: Whenever I have to do any calculations involving area/volume/length at work, I first convert the imperial/US units to metric, then calculate the answer, and then convert the answer back to imperial/US units :retard:

[ArizonaKev]

We Yanks and Brits sure make it hard on ourselves - and each other - don't we? When I was a kid, I learned the metric system, and although I didn't like it at first, it seems SOOOO much easier to be able to convert to all different kinds of measurements by simply moving a decimal, doesn't it?

I mean, 1000mL = 1L, 100cL = 1L, 10dL = 1L - easy, right, you just move the decimal?

But here in the US, it's 8oz = 1 cup, 4 cups = 1qt, 4 qts = 1 gal, 2 cups = 1 pint, 8 pints = 1 gal.... simple, right! NOT!

LOL! Don't get me wrong - I LOVE the USA. It's just that with my math skills, I am much better at adding or taking away zeroes than remembering all kinds of coversions and adding/subtracting fractions :??:

Ha ha! Ride safe all :2tup:

AZ Kev