Bike just won't start!

[RavenousPirate]

Hey everyone,

Haven't started the motorcycle for a few months due to it needing maintenance and the whole winter thing.

Trying to get it started again, and it will turn over but it just won't fire. I've tried a few simple things like replacing the spark plug and push starting the bike but I can't get it to go. Any suggestions?

[mole2]

If it sat for a couple of months the fuel in the carb may have evaporated. Did you set the fuel switch on PRI (prime) for a few mintues before attempting to start to try and prime the carb?


:)

[alantf]

Have you tried flicking the red kill switch on & off a few times? Usually works for me when it won't start up straight away.

[mrlmd1]

Make sure the battery is FULLY charged.

[burkbuilds]

All of the above and one more, if the gas had 10% ethanol in it, that stuff goes bad pretty quickly and just won't fire. If none of the above tips work, drain the gas completely out and start fresh.

[RavenousPirate]

I've set the fuel switch to prime and fully charged the battery. Haven't tried flicking the kill switch or completely changing out the gas so I'll give that a shot after work today. Thanks!

[Easy Rider]

I've set the fuel switch to prime and fully charged the battery. Haven't tried flicking the kill switch or completely changing out the gas so I'll give that a shot after work today. Thanks!

When you changed the plugs, did you do a "spark test" ??
Are you using the choke ?? Folks in Fla. sometimes don't know what a choke IS !! :biggrin:

After that, a little starting fluid (ether) might help get it going.

[RavenousPirate]

Haha, yeah I'm using the choke. I've also put some starting fluid into the gas and nothing.

However, I don't know what a "spark test" is. Explain, please =D

[Easy Rider]

However, I don't know what a "spark test" is. Explain, please =D

You take a loose spark plug, connect the wire to it and lay it against the frame or head. When you run the starter and the engine turns over, you should be able to see/hear a spark jump across the plug gap. If you have an old plug in reasonably good condition, you do NOT have to remove the "working" plug to do the test.

Starter fluid (ether) is applied a tiny bit at time into the air cleaner.....NOT into the gas tank.

You should get into the habit of reading the lables on ALL products that you use !! :cool:

The choke should not be left completely ON for more than a couple of seconds; then move it to about half.

[RavenousPirate]

Starter fluid (ether) is applied a tiny bit at time into the air cleaner.....NOT into the gas tank.

You should get into the habit of reading the lables on ALL products that you use !! :cool:

Er, sorry, not starting fluid... I put fuel treatment into the fuel. Had the two confused.

However, speaking of starting fluid, I did try to use it today. Can told me to spray it for about 3 seconds into the air intake and then try to start, which I did. The engine fired but died out immediately... Turned the throttle a few more times and it started making a clicking noise. After trying to start it over the last couple of days the battery is about dead. Do you think this would work once I'm able to get the battery fully charged? Or is there something else I should look into?

Haven't tried the spark test because I don't know what you mean by the wire. Very very new to this :-D

[Water Warrior 2]

You will need a fully charged battery before making any more attempts. A small 2 amp charger would be handy for a bike battery. Anything greater will tend to cook the battery. Also consider a battery tender for the times the bike is out of action for extended periods. A tender is cheaper than a new battery. Don't ask me how I know. :whistle:

[frempath]

If it fired the starting fluid, I would think that the problem goes back to fuel delivery. To me it sounds like your gasoline varnished and either the fuel lines are plugged or the carbs are gummed up in a closed position.

[alantf]

I don't know what you mean by the wire.

The lead that goes to the top of the plug when the engine is running. It pushes onto the top of the plug (with a slight click) by way of that black rubber thingummy. :2tup:

[Easy Rider]

Can told me to spray it for about 3 seconds into the air intake and then try to start, which I did.

Do you think this would work once I'm able to get the battery fully charged? Or is there something else I should look into?

Haven't tried the spark test because I don't know what you mean by the wire. Very very new to this :-D

OK, forget the spark plug wire; apparently there IS spark.

The 3 seconds spray is for a CAR; for a bike, a one second would be more appropriate; then repeated 1 second sprays to keep it going for a little while to get some gas circulating in the carb.

Yes, a fully charged battery is VERY important.

Also draining the carb bowl might help. On the very bottom of the carb is a nipple pointing down (with a rubber hose on it ? I don't remember) and a screw at the top of it. If you loosen that screw, with the petcock set on PRIme, fuel should flow out (catch it in a can or cup;NOT styrfoam). Let 4 or 5 ounces flow. If that doesn't work, then you have a serious fuel flow problem. If it does work, then close the screw and try to start again.....with a charged battery and a little starter fluid. If the situation doesn't get any better, then your carb needs a manual cleaning and that is usually not a good thing for a rookie to be doing.

P.S. Where you at in Florida? I'll be down there in a couple of weeks.......and we have a few other members scattered around down there too.

[RavenousPirate]

Alright, battery charger arrived so I charged the bike all the way today. Used the starting fluid again, it fired but wouldn't stay running.

Did what you said with the carburetor, I believe. I loosened the screw going into the hose on the bottom... this caused gasoline to leak out from a hose that comes out of the bottom of the bike. I let 4 or 5 ounces drain into a cup, tried the starting fluid again.

Now the bike will fire as long as there's starting fluid in it, but it won't stay running unless I keep the throttle pulled all of the way. Once I release it, the bike will just die out. Any other suggestions, or do you think the carburetor needs to be cleaned out?

Also, I'm in Orlando. Just moved here a week or two ago.

[alanmcorcoran]

Did you have choke on? If it runs with the throttle open, it may just be a fouled carb. How long did you keep it running before you gave up? (try at least ten minutes.) I had to run mine for about 10-15 minutes one day before it would let me throttle up without stalling. This was after it had sat for a few weeks. I assume prior posters have recommended Berryman's, seafoam, etc. Mine cleared up with regular riding this time, but last year (I think after over filling the oil) I had to have the carb cleaned at a shop before it would run properly. It's been running decently (assuming I get on it once a week) ever since.

[burkbuilds]

I will repeat, if the gas has been in the tank for several months and it has ethanol in it, drain it all out and start with fresh gas! I've messed with motors for hours and couldn't get them running then finally drained them, put in fresh gas and they fired right up. That ethanol crap doesn't have much of a shelf life!

[Easy Rider]

Did you have choke on?

And is the stock air cleaner still in place ?? It should be.

You should have the choke operated about 3/4 and you should NOT touch the throttle (leave it closed) until you hear the engine fire.

And until you get this resolved, you should leave the petcock in the PRIme position while you are trying to start it.

Alas, I think the bottom line is going to be that the low speed jets are completely clogged and you will need a manual carb cleaning.

If you had cleaner in the gas tank when you did the "bleed", I was hoping that you would get enough cleaner into the carb to "unstick" it after it sat for a while. Charge the battery again and give it one more try before giving up and calling the shop.

[bonehead]

Just a SWAG here, is the idle adjustment screw adjusted properly. I know mine vibrates to a lower idle over time. How many miles on the bike? What's the service history?

[RavenousPirate]

Haven't been able to check the forums the last couple days, sorry about that.

I didn't try running the bike for that long, no. I think I kept the throttle down for about a minute or so.

Stock air cleaner is still in place to my knowledge but I can check that tomorrow. Yes, I've had the choke on everytime I've tried as well as leaving the petcock on prime.

I haven't tried replacing the gas, so I will try that tomorrow. Also, I haven't checked the idle adjustment screw but I can give that a look tomorrow as well. What exactly am I looking for? =D

There's 5800 miles on the bike. It had one previous owner, and to my knowledge the only service done on it was to replace the rear reflector or something like that due to a recall. Other than that, I've replaced the front brake pads myself.

[alanmcorcoran]

You want to have an idle above 1000 rpms, but not much above that. The idle screw is a white plastic dial you'll find down around your ankle. It's a good idea to mark where it's set before you start moving it, and stick to no more than quarter turns until you get a feel for what you are doing. I recommend you kind of work it back and forth a little as you turn it so there's no unreleased tension left in the cable pulleys. It's not a real sophisticated control and, like a piano, it can drift a bit when you are "tuning" it.

Frankly, I suggest you hold off mucking with the idle until you make some progress on getting the bike to run (unless it is idling very slowly and roughly.) Let me explain why - GZ's don't really get running well until they are warmed up and, in my experience, this takes at least ten minutes. You don't want to mess with the idle when it is not warmed up - you'll probably set it too high. On the flip side, it's easy to set the idle too low after it's warmed up. You definitely don't want to mess with the idle when the choke is on. Others have posted about devices that can act as pseudo-tachometers. I think most of us can tell by the sound. It should be relatively quiet at idle but not so slow you can hear it "chugging." Some have said that it should idle higher than a car. I'm not sure about that - depends on the car I guess.

Don't leave the petcock on prime. I think that's been said many times. That will led to flooding and fouling of the carb. I've left my bike sitting sometimes for six weeks or more and I still haven't had to use the "prime" setting at all to get it started, never mind leaving it in that position. I have often had to leave it running in the garage for ten minutes to stabilize the carburation after a lengthy layoff.

The carb is very sensitive on the GZ and it doesn't like to sit unused. On the plus side, often a hundred and fifty miles of fresh gas (with, perhaps, some carb cleaner) will often fix it right up. Don't sweat it if it continues to run like crap for the first 60-100 miles.

If you get it running again, leave the choke on, at least enough to keep it going, and let it run for twenty minutes (open your garage door!) before you try to ride it. If it's still stalling after that, I recommend you take it to a dealer or a service shop.

I suspect it just hasn't been ridden for a long time and, as someone suggested above, it's clogged up.

I suppose this is obvious, but in case it isn't: riding a bike with stalling and running issues greatly increases your odds of getting into trouble - both roadside breakdown trouble (trust me, you don't want to push 300 pounds uphill wearing MC gear) as well as accident trouble. Running trouble is a huge distraction and will suck up your brainpower, the brainpower that should be watching out for road hazards, wet leaves, oblivious drivers, deer, etc. I'm just saying, I know it costs money to get the bike serviced, but it will cost you a lot more if you lose the use of your leg cause you were screwing with the choke/throttle/idle when you should have been watching out for the guy making a left in front of you.

Good luck, let us know how you make out.

[alantf]

There's 5800 miles on the bike. and to my knowledge the only service done on it was to replace the rear reflector

Oh shit!!!!!!!!!!! at 5800 miles you're about due your SECOND oil/filter change. If it's never had the first change done, get it done NOW, as there's sure to be microscopic metal traces in the oil from the running in!

[alantf]

You want to have an idle above 1000 rpms, but not much above that. The idle screw is a white plastic dial you'll find down around your ankle.

Suzuki say 1200 - 1400, so use that as a starting point (when you get it running, & the engine's nice & hot!). When you get used to the sound/feel of the bike, you'll be able to use your own judgement as to what feels right. Like it's been said before, the gz has a VERY temperamental carb.

Alan must have the queerest body shape ever. The big white adjusting knob is just under the tank, behind the carb. This seems to suggest that Alan's ankles start just below the kneecap!:cry: :whistle:

[alanmcorcoran]

Well, the general vicinity. Bike IS a bit small for me. Thanks for clarification.

[Easy Rider]

Well, the general vicinity. Bike IS a bit small for me. Thanks for clarification.

Excellent post Alan! :tup:

(We'll cut you a little slack for not knowing the difference between your knee and your ankle!) :crackup

[RavenousPirate]

Alright, finally a day off from school and work so I'm going to be working on this again today. Charging the battery as I type this...

Oh shit!!!!!!!!!!! at 5800 miles you're about due your SECOND oil/filter change. If it's never had the first change done, get it done NOW, as there's sure to be microscopic metal traces in the oil from the running in!

It has had the oil changed once before. Forgot to mention that =P

Don't leave the petcock on prime. I think that's been said many times. That will led to flooding and fouling of the carb

Right, I do know this. I meant I've been turning it on whenever I try to start the bike. I turn it off once the bike is started, and leave it off when it's sitting.

My plan for today is to drain out the gas in the tank and replace it with new gasoline. From there if I can get it started I'll let it run for a while and work from there.

From the suggestions I'm reading, it seems you want me to let it sit idle while it's running, but the last time that I started it I could only get it to stay running if I kept the throttle pulled. Would keeping the throttle pulled for around ten minutes be advisable? Or should I just take it to a shop now if I can't even get it to idle?

[Water Warrior 2]

Add a little carb cleaner to the gas. Ten minutes might be a tad too long. You could overheat the engine. If, a big IF it will run fairly well after 5 minutes then go for a ride. At least that is what I would do in this case. If the carb is really gunked up internally things won't play out too well. Lotsa luck to you.

[Easy Rider]

From the suggestions I'm reading, it seems you want me to let it sit idle while it's running, but the last time that I started it I could only get it to stay running if I kept the throttle pulled. Would keeping the throttle pulled for around ten minutes be advisable? Or should I just take it to a shop now if I can't even get it to idle?

That depends on how FAR you have the throttle open and how FAST it makes it run.
You need to keep it at or near idle speed for a few minutes; how you accomplish that isn't really too important.

It would appear, though, that you have a major carb problem, since having the choke fully operated should also make it run fairly fast. If the only way it will stay running is REAL FAST, then you're probably destined for a trip to the shop, as you should NOT run it real fast for more than a few seconds.

[alanmcorcoran]

Ravenous,

Let me preface this with the caveat, "I'm not a real mechanic, and I couldn't even play one on TV." I sort of had the opposite problem - mine would idle, but as soon as I touched the throttle it would stall out. Basically it couldn't handle anything but the minimal RPM's. That being said, I've let mine idle for ten minutes or more without any noticeable issues. The main thing I can tell you is that, I have on multiple occasions, experienced extremely crappy carburation issues that cleared up entirely simply by getting 150 miles of gas and some carb cleaner through the works. And, on one occasion, no amount of riding would fix it and I had to take it to a dealer to get it fixed. On the had-to-go-to-the-dealer problem, it actually took three visits until they got it fixed up. I'm not sure if they just shined on the carb cleaning or what they did wrong the first two times, but when I went down there the THIRD time and made a complete asshole of myself (not difficult for me) they got it fixed right up (and it's been running good ever since.)

So to sum up: Many GZ carb issues are the result of inactivity, which the bike is very sensitive to, and can be self fixed by non-mechanics if you can get the bike to run well enough to run a tank of gas through it. But some are not going to respond to this and will need to be addressed by a mechanic. It's going to be up to you to decide which category yours falls in. Good luck and let us know how you make out.

Be careful with the gas. Don't mess with the spark plug, or the battery or the battery charger, if you got gas all over the place. Avoid wearing synthetic clothing when working around gas, especially "pull-over" (non button) shirts. If you get gas on your clothes, stop what you are doing and carefully change your clothes. And no smoking!

[RavenousPirate]

Okay... Status update!

I charged up the battery again, emptied out the gas tank, replaced it with fresh gas, and put carburetor treatment into it.

The bike now starts flawlessly, don't even have to set it to prime. However, it still won't idle. From this, do you guys think it's still a carburetor problem or should I start adjusting the idle screw? I didn't really want to toy with it since I have no way of telling how many rpm's the engine is doing. I took a picture of mine in the hopes that you guys could look at it and tell me if it's too low or not.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v483/ ... rcycle.jpg (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v483/woodlediaper/motorcycle.jpg)

Another question... after replacing the gas I set the petcock to prime again and noticed that gas was leaking out of a hose under the seat, behind and to the left of the battery if you're looking at the right side of the motorcycle. What is this hose and why is it leaking gasoline on my motorcycle?! If you're looking at the parts manual, it's number 46 under carburetor.

[alanmcorcoran]

You'd do better with a video (with sound.) If you mark (with a sharpie, say) where the idle is set to and keep track of direction and turns, you can always put it back to where it was. It's a pretty simple control.

I'm a little confused about the gas leak (again, you shouldn't need to be priming it.) The tube sounds like the drain tube for the filter box, but it shouldn't have any gas in it. (I don't have a manual handy to look up the number.)

[Easy Rider]

I didn't really want to toy with it since I have no way of telling how many rpm's the engine is doing.

Another question... after replacing the gas I set the petcock to prime again and noticed that gas was leaking out of a hose under the seat,

Those two things taken together......that you don't think you can get close to an appropriate idle speed by ear AND that you now have a gas leak....makes me believe that you NEED to visit a dealer.

Are you saying that it will not hold an idle even WITH the choke operated ??
What is the other end of the leaking hose connected TO ??

It could mean that the float is stuck and it won't idle because it is flooding out.
Regardless of the cause of the leak, you are now in a situation that could be DANGEROUS.

[RavenousPirate]

Are you saying that it will not hold an idle even WITH the choke operated ??
What is the other end of the leaking hose connected TO ??

It could mean that the float is stuck and it won't idle because it is flooding out.
Regardless of the cause of the leak, you are now in a situation that could be DANGEROUS.

Correct. It won't hold an idle even with the choke on.

The hose isn't connected to anything. It comes out of the side of the carburetor, goes above/behind the battery along the side of the air cleaner, and then down along the luggage box underneath the seat where there is a clip that holds it into place and it ends. As far as I can tell there's nothing to attach the hose to.

Sigh. I think I'll just give up and take it to a dealer at this point. Oh well. I want to thank you guys for giving me so much help on this. Sorry for the dumb questions =P

[bonehead]

Haven't been able to check the forums the last couple days, sorry about that.

I didn't try running the bike for that long, no. I think I kept the throttle down for about a minute or so.

Stock air cleaner is still in place to my knowledge but I can check that tomorrow. Yes, I've had the choke on everytime I've tried as well as leaving the petcock on prime.

I haven't tried replacing the gas, so I will try that tomorrow. Also, I haven't checked the idle adjustment screw but I can give that a look tomorrow as well. What exactly am I looking for? =D

There's 5800 miles on the bike. It had one previous owner, and to my knowledge the only service done on it was to replace the rear reflector or something like that due to a recall. Other than that, I've replaced the front brake pads myself.
My suggestion at this point would be to get a complete service done at the dealer or a good independant shop. I mean have them go over everything. Usually it costs about 300.00 and they check everything, including valve adj., throttle, brakes,etc. You, as the new owner, will then know what has been done to the bike.

Just a suggestion, FWIW.

[burkbuilds]

I'll second bonehead's recommendation. After 5,000 miles your valves probably need adjustment anyway and having a dealer go over the bike sounds like a good thing to do.