Ran out of gas = improved performance ?

[flainn]

Yesterday while riding home I learned that the fuel cock on my GZ250 does not work the way I thought. I thought it was on "ON" while it was actually on "RES". This is because the selector is, IMO, poorly designed, and also because I had never run the fuel down that low before. I guess I should have paid more attention to the fuel selector in the manual...

My odometer read 244.x miles when I ran out of gas. Fortunately, I was near the top of a hill on so I simply turned around and coasted back to a gas station. I think quite a few people were laughing at the guy pushing his big cruiser back to town.

3.743 gallons to fill up from bone-dry. With premium fuel that cost me $8.38. I got 65.2 miles per gallon riding mostly from home to work, about half on the highway (55 mph) and half in town (25-35 mph). I don't always ride conservatively, either, so it still gets decent mileage even with quick takeoffs.

The interesting thing is, though, that I think running it out of gas was actually good for the bike. Ever since I got it running last August, acceleration has been not-smooth. When I would first open the throttle it would take off, then drop off, then take off again. Also, recently it started backfiring when I would let off the throttle completely while in gear (I posted about that a while back). That was annoying but didn't seem to affect performance.

Well, yesterday morning (before I ran it out of gas) it took some effort to start — a bunch of cranking and messing with the choke, and then when it started up (on no choke, as it turned out) it revved way up. So I tweaked the idle set to bring it back down. I noticed it seemed to be running smoother (and the exhaust sounded throatier) than usual. And, best of all, it did not backfire the entire way to work. Not only that, but I had completely smooth throttle response and noticeably more power than usual. Same story at lunch and going home after filling the tank.

Maybe a jet finally unclogged, or something? Not sure. Last August it took quite a bit of seafoam and cranking the engine to get it to finally fire up, but it has seemed to run well (with the exception of non-smooth throttle response) since then. I've been meaning to give it a tuneup once the weather got warmer, but now I'm kind of thinking I should leave it alone! :)

Now that it's got more power, I need to take it up to 65-70 and see what the new top end is. I haven't been able to get it to do much more than 75 on the flat so far, but that's probably as much due to the fact that I need to lose 40 pounds as the fact that it's got a small engine.

All in all, I'm pleased. It's now acting more like I expected this bike to act. I wish it hadn't taken eight months to get here, but hey.

[alanmcorcoran]

Does yours have the emissions canister? BTW, the RES vs On is a classic. See other threads.

I am curious to see if your experience sheds any light on some running problems Easy, Canuck and I have had.

[Easy Rider]

I guess I should have paid more attention to the fuel selector in the manual...

My odometer read 244.x miles when I ran out of gas.

With premium fuel that cost me $8.38.

The interesting thing is, though, that I think running it out of gas was actually good for the bike.

Last August it took quite a bit of seafoam and cranking the engine to get it to finally fire up,

So MANY things to comment on and so little time! :biggrin:

I know I risk being characterized as a "grouch old bastard" but I don't really care because my intention is to HELP you out. The advice is free; take it or leave it as you see fit.

In addition to the manual, the lever direction on the petcock has been discussed at some length RIGHT HERE. Scanning the old threads can be VERY helpful. :tup:

If you are going to reset the trip odometer after each fillup, maybe you should then pay attention to it as you ride.......maybe ??? :roll: I never go past 200 before a fill.

We have also discussed premium fuel at some length. Not only is it not necessary, it is not good for at least 2 reasons. It burns a tiny bit slower and may actually result in worse performance. Stations don't sell as much premium......except maybe Beverly Hills and Palm Springs....so the fuel in the storage tanks is older and more prone to have water and other contaminents. Your situation may have been water accumulated in the carb. or tank.

There are better carb. cleaners than Seaform. Seafoam is good for routine maintenance to prevent a problem with gum build up but it is not really that good at fixing a problem that has already arisen. Gumout Carb and Choke cleaner and Berryman's B12 are better problem solvers.

And, last but not least, carb. cleaners do not make good fuel.....especially not Seafoam......so adding a LOT of it to your gas when you are having trouble starting is probably NOT a good thing to do. Too much Stabil in the gas can make it run rough too.

Cheers! Glad to hear the little beast is running good now.

[flainn]

Does yours have the emissions canister? BTW, the RES vs On is a classic. See other threads.

I am curious to see if your experience sheds any light on some running problems Easy, Canuck and I have had.

No idea if I have the canister or not. Did the 2001 model have one? Mine is basically bone stock, so if it did it probably still does.

[flainn]

In addition to the manual, the lever direction on the petcock has been discussed at some length RIGHT HERE. Scanning the old threads can be VERY helpful. :tup:


Didn't know. I actually don't spend much time on GZ250Bike except to report weirdnesses with the bike. The rest of the time I'd rather be riding than surfing :tongue:


If you are going to reset the trip odometer after each fillup, maybe you should then pay attention to it as you ride.......maybe ??? :roll: I never go past 200 before a fill.


Mea culpa, man. I thought I remembered reading somewhere that you could get 250 miles out of a tank, but apparently my memory was wrong. I can assure you I won't make that mistake again!


We have also discussed premium fuel at some length. Not only is it not necessary, it is not good for at least 2 reasons. It burns a tiny bit slower and may actually result in worse performance. Stations don't sell as much premium......except maybe Beverly Hills and Palm Springs....so the fuel in the storage tanks is older and more prone to have water and other contaminents. Your situation may have been water accumulated in the carb. or tank.


I mostly have been putting premium in it due to the slightly higher octane number. I don't get to ride as much as I'd like so I figure higher octane = gas lasts longer. Didn't have any performance considerations. Besides, for a full tank the price difference is what, eighty cents?

That said, though, I was not aware of the information you've provided here. I'll start using regular.


There are better carb. cleaners than Seaform. Seafoam is good for routine maintenance to prevent a problem with gum build up but it is not really that good at fixing a problem that has already arisen. Gumout Carb and Choke cleaner and Berryman's B12 are better problem solvers.


I only used the Seafoam once, eight months ago, to clean things up since the bike would not start and had been sitting for a long time. This was after draining the old gas, too. I haven't put any in since. But what can I say, what you're saying here is the opposite of the advice I was given in other places. Sometimes it's hard to know who to believe.


And, last but not least, carb. cleaners do not make good fuel.....especially not Seafoam......so adding a LOT of it to your gas when you are having trouble starting is probably NOT a good thing to do. Too much Stabil in the gas can make it run rough too.


Again, haven't used any since the initial adding to a tank of gas. It's long gone now, especially since I just ran the tank completely dry. But I'll remember this stuff in the future. Thanks for your advice. I've only got eight months' experience with the GZ whereas you guys have a lot more.

[music man]

There are better carb. cleaners than Seafoam. Seafoam is good for routine maintenance to prevent a problem with gum build up but it is not really that good at fixing a problem that has already arisen. Gumout Carb and Choke cleaner and Berryman's B12 are better problem solvers.

And, last but not least, carb. cleaners do not make good fuel.....especially not Seafoam......so adding a LOT of it to your gas when you are having trouble starting is probably NOT a good thing to do. Too much Stabil in the gas can make it run rough too.



I will agree wholeheartedly with all of that, I used to believe that Seafoam was the best Carb cleaner, but after Easy recommended Berryman's B12 I used it and haven't looked back, I use it in my car and my wife's car about every 4-5 tankfuls (Berrymans that is). On the other hand, I have had several small engine guys from Briggs & Stratton and Kohler tell me that they have personally seen the effects of Seafoam on the internal parts of an engine, i.e. the valves and top of the piston, and say that it really cleans up the carbon deposits inside your engine, but like I said I have found Berrymans B12 to be a much superior product in the carb cleaning department. But if you really have a gunked up carb there is really no substitute to taking it apart and using spray carb cleaner on/in it.

As for the carb cleaners and additives not making good fuel, he is exactly right, especially Stabil, I accidently poured too much of that shit in my bike one time and it ran like shit.

[Easy Rider]

I actually don't spend much time on GZ250Bike except to report weirdnesses with the bike. The rest of the time I'd rather be riding than surfing :tongue:


I can understand that......and it is good that you are keeping us up to date with your saga. I hope that doesn't mean that you will disappear completely when you get it running right again. :tup:

And, yes, I know that Seafoam is the most remarkable discovery since fire but that says more about Seafoam's successful marketing than about stark reality. Seafoam has 2 solvents; the others I mentioned have FIVE. Even if you can't spell "chemistry", which one do you think would be the best? :biggrin:

[adrianinflorida]

http://i78.photobucket.com/albums/j88/Engineer303/bike/a389_1_b.jpg

For example, the above petcock is in the "Fuel" or normal position, turned 180 degress to the right would be the "Reserve" position. Whichever way the long part of the petcock dial is pointing, is the position that is selected.

[Sarris]

I always remember that it's backassward.

:neener:

[adrianinflorida]

I always remember that it's backassward.

:neener:
Same here. :)

[alanmcorcoran]

I only look at it when I'm at the gas station (and I'm desperately trying not to forget to switch it back from reserve to "ON")

Sometimes I don't even look at it then. Typically, if I run it down to reserve, the engine coughs a bit or hesitates and I generally am able to reach under my knee and flip it backward. I'm not the world's most skilled rider but I've done this several times at high speed on multilane highways, so it can't be that hard.

So I think of it - frontwards is NORMAL, backwards means GO TO GAS STATION SOON (and don't forget to put it back and reset trip OD). Since it won't go over the top, it's pretty easy to tell by feel which position it's in.

Now if I could only master the F*cking turn signals.

[roncg41677]

Knowing where the petcock lever is pointing is pretty simple: only one end of the lever can point to "Prime". That is the end that points to the other 2 settings ;)

As far as your bike running better, just count your blessings :). Maybe the Seafoam finally worked its way completely out of the tank so now you're burning pure fuel?

[alanmcorcoran]

only one end of the lever can point to "Prime". That is the end that points to the other 2 settings

Well said sir. That's what I was trying to say when I said "it won't go over the top."