trouble starting... help!

[hot_lava]

My little GZ sits for a week or two at a time sometimes, depending on the weather and my schedule...so I know to turn the fuel valve to the "PRI" setting just to start it then putting it back to "ON" when it's been sitting...

This time though, it's not working! I always have to turn the choke up when I start it after sitting for a while (even a couple of days)...and I did that too! The engine tries to turn but just won't get there...I'm guessing maybe a dead battery? A bike riding friend of mine said if the horn still works the battery isn't dead, and the horn did work when I tried it...so I'm just not sure what to think now. I know a pretty fair amount about car engines and am still learning about bikes. I just bought my GZ in June.

The bike is a 2001 model and I know it sat a lot with the previous owner (only had 1800 miles when I bought it)... so who knows if the battery has ever been replaced. I have a charger and he showed me how to use it, should I try that? (I've been hesitant since there's no outlet outside of my house and I'm afraid of using an extension cord with the charger)

Also, and maybe I should have mentioned this earlier...but I didn't get the cover on it in time for a pretty big downpour we had here recently...it was out in the rain for a day or so...could this have done permanent damage? On that note, is it ever ok to leave your bike out in the rain? I mean, it happens, right?

It's a perfect weekend for riding, I'm frustrated!!! Any tips are appreciated :roll:

Ava

[music man]

First of all, I am scared of your friends advice if he thinks that just because the horn honks that the battery isn't too dead to start your bike. It takes a very minimal amount of energy to honk the horn on anything, especially the little roadrunner horn on the GZ, BEEP BEEP!.


Second, no the rain should not permanently damage your bike, not only does mine get rained on, I ride it in the rain sometimes. I am not saying that water can't get into to things and have a bad effect on them but normally occasionally getting rained on shouldn't harm your bike, (you wash it with water right?) That being said you could have gotten a contact or something wet that is affecting the electrical system, but I doubt it.

And yes your battery might be dead, if your engine just won't turn over. you could take the battery out and hook it up to a charger closer to the house, you could jump start it, you could push start it, you could get a heavy gauge extension cord for your charger, or you could take the battery out and take it and have it tested. My suggestion would be to either try and charge it or take it and have it tested.

[Easy Rider]

1) so I know to turn the fuel valve to the "PRI" setting just to start it then putting it back to "ON" when it's been sitting...

2) The engine tries to turn but just won't get there...I'm guessing maybe a dead battery?

3) I have a charger and he showed me how to use it, should I try that?



A classic worn out battery story if there ever was one. :cry:
It is probably the original and is WELL beyond it's useful life.

1) Actually, you should set the valve to PRI and leave it there for at least a few minutes BEFORE you try to start it.

2) The "horn" test is ...mmmm...BS, at best. You appear to have more savy than your "friend". :roll:

3) What capacity is the charger? It's likely that it will draw no more than a large light bulb and would be safe to use with all but the cheapest and thinest extension cords. If the charger capacity is 3 amps or more, a couple of hours should be enough to get it going; if you are really in a pinch, a half hour might be barely enough.

Charge it and ride it to the nearest "real" battery store, where they can test the battery and your charging system, probably for free. Take about $90 with you. GZ batteries are not cheap!!

[5th_bike]

My little GZ sits for a week or two at a time sometimes, depending on the weather and my schedule...so I know to turn the fuel valve to the "PRI" setting just to start it then putting it back to "ON" when it's been sitting...

I don't thimk it is necessary to put it to "pri" after it has been sitting for two weeks. I used mine quite regularly every two weeks last winter, and never had to switch the petcock to "pri".

To keep the battery up and running I think you should ride it for at least half an hour, te recharge the load that starting cost you. Just having it sit and idle for a bit will not recharge your battery sufficiently.

[Dupo]

1. Put that battery on a charger. NOT a car charger. Make sure it is one made to charge motorcycle batteries. A trickle charger is best. If you are going to let it sit, put it on the trickle charger. Best one to get is the kind that shuts itself off when its done charging. Running an extension cord is fine. It wont hurt anything as long as you are using a orange heavy duty one. Dont use some crappy household extension cord.

2. Putting it to PRI prior to starting does nothing. PRI is for when you run out of fuel. What PRI does is it lets the fuel free flow into the carb. Putting it to PRI for any other reason is not necessary. Pulling out the choke and starting it is all you need to do.

3. musicman is correct. It take VERY little to make a horn beep. Your friend dont know what he's talking about. The battery needs enough juice to start the bike. If its not there .. its not going to start. Ever have a dead battery in a car ... the lights would go on but the battery just made the starter click click click? Now, see #1 and put it on a charger.

4. Rain ... pfff. Mine sits in the rain way too much. Only thing its gonna damage is your chrome.

Bikes for the most part, are just like your car. you said you are familiar with cars ... apply that knowledge to your bike. Carb, pistons, battery, electrical system. Its all basic stuff. Bikes arent much different.

Just remember the most important thing ... get a GOOD charger thats made for bikes. (see link below)

http://www.cyclegear.com/spgm.cfm?L1=&L ... 3&tier2=38 (http://www.cyclegear.com/spgm.cfm?L1=&L2=&L3=&L4=&item=DEL_021-0123&tier2=38)

The Deltran Battery Tender Junior is much more than a trickle charger. It has a brain.

Lightweight, compact, and fully automatic, the Battery Tender Junior is very easy to use, especially in small spaces. The Junior 12V will keep your battery fully charged so that it's ready to go when you are!

Features and Benefits

* Perfect for all lead-acid, flooded, or sealed maintenance-free batteries (AGM and gel cell)
* Complete 4-step charging program: Initialization, Bulk Charge, Absorption Mode, Float Mode
* Automatically switches to float / maintenance voltage after fully charging the battery
* If battery voltage drops too far under load, full charger output-power resumes
* Solid-state, two-color LED indicates stage of charger
* Sparkproof
* Reverse-polarity protected

[Easy Rider]

I don't thimk it is necessary to put it to "pri" after it has been sitting for two weeks. I used mine quite regularly every two weeks last winter, and never had to switch the petcock to "pri".


Gas evaporates from the bowl MUCH more quickly in the summer time !! :biggrin:

[Easy Rider]

1. Put that battery on a charger. NOT a car charger.

2. Putting it to PRI prior to starting does nothing.

OK, time for a fight. Put 'em up !! :skull: :biggrin:

A bike battery is just a small car battery. Any "good" modern battery charger WILL work just fine for a bike battery, if used occasionally to recover the battery from an "oops" and if used with a little sense.......like disconnecting it when the charging current drops off.
For this kind of use, if you already have a "car" charger, there is ABSOLUTLEY no reason to buy another one. NONE.

Now, if you want something to keep the battery charged over a storage period, then you need a "Battery Tender" type of charger which is automatic and has a "float" mode. Getting one specifically labeled for motorcycle use is OK but, again, not necessary as long as it is designed to float the battery for storage. And, incidentally, using a "motorcycle" charger on a car battery is OK too but it might take longer to charge if the battery is dead.

12 volts is 12 volts. Doesn't matter what size package it comes in. One exception: You should NOT ***NEVER*** use a large shop charger on a motorcycle battery if it has a "Start" setting. Using that setting connected to a bike battery can boil it quickly and cause all kinds of problems.

Carb and PRIme: If the bike has not been run for a while, the gas in the carb bowl tends to evaporate. Setting it to PRIme can make starting a LOT easier, as there isn't enough vacuum during cranking to open the petcock when it's on ON or RES.

[Dupo]

I used a car charger for an 'oops' .... the output from it was too much ... blew my LEDs.

Purchased a GOOD battery tender/charger (like the one in the link i provided). Never had a problem again. Good reason to buy one ..... two words ... quick disconnect.

[Easy Rider]

I used a car charger for an 'oops' .... the output from it was too much ... blew my LEDs.



Blew WHAT LED's ???
If you had the ignition turned ON during the charge, it is hardly the charger's fault !!! :biggrin:

[Dupo]

My purple lighting LED's. Blew them right out.

[hot_lava]

thanks for all the help everyone...it def was the battery, when i put my car sense to it i figured it had to be that!

i have a a motorcycle charger thing and it worked great with the extention cord and all...getting the bike DOWN the street, up my neighbors driveway and back DOWN the sidewalk into my backyard to reach it was, er, a little of a workout (i know the GZ's are only a few hundred pounds, but i'm only 115!)...but well worth it when i heard her purring again :)

as far as the PRI setting goes, when my bike has been sitting for a while it definitely helps it start much better than the regular 'on' setting...and thanks to Easy Rider for the tip about setting it there a few minutes before starting it up.

lastly (and i guess this counts as a new topic), is there anything you can really do for the rust on the chrome parts? there's definitely some already there on my bike...oy.

it's a beautiful evening, i'm going riding woohoo!

[Easy Rider]

lastly (and i guess this counts as a new topic), is there anything you can really do for the rust on the chrome parts? there's definitely some already there on my bike...oy.


If it is just brown/orange discoloration, then any good chrome cleaner/polish will do.

If there is actually a rough spot or tiny pit, then 0000 steel wool used to apply the cleaner/polish will help. Just don't put too much pressure on the steel wool.

Much of what LOOKS like chrome on today's bikes is really plastic. Do NOT use steel wool on shiny plastic !!! :cry:

[goneoutflying]

As far as the battery charger I use a car charger however I removed the battery from the bike and set it for the 2 amp charge (the battery label says .7A for slow charge and 3A for quick charge) took about an hour to charge the battery to where I could start my bike.

[Easy Rider]

I removed the battery from the bike

Perfect......almost. :)
It is absolutely not necessary to remove the battery from the bike, if there is enough clearance to connect the clamps.
That does allow you to clean the terminals and snug the connections but a quick look and a tug would tell you that they are clean and tight.

How many times have you seen the battery removed from another kind of vehicle just to charge it?

[goneoutflying]

I removed the battery from the bike

Perfect......almost. :)
It is absolutely not necessary to remove the battery from the bike, if there is enough clearance to connect the clamps.
That does allow you to clean the terminals and snug the connections but a quick look and a tug would tell you that they are clean and tight.

How many times have you seen the battery removed from another kind of vehicle just to charge it?


I live in a apartment complex, the second floor at that. The parking lot is quit a distance , about 300 to 400 ft, that would take a really long extension cord, Taking the battery out and bringing it up is a bit easer. (I have had to do that with a car battery too!)

And yes if you go to a auto parts store most of the time they will take out the battery to charge it, just in case there is a power drain causing the problem. I say "Most of the time" because even though I have never seen them charge a battery in a vehicle before, I am sure that there is an exception somewhere. :roll:

[Easy Rider]

I live in a apartment complex, the second floor at that.

And yes if you go to a auto parts store most of the time they will take out the battery to charge it, just in case there is a power drain causing the problem.

:oops:
In the absence of an outlet on the side of the building, I'd say that's a pretty good reason !! :)

As for the car thing, if you can DRIVE it to the store in the first place, it can't be in THAT bad shape. I think you will find that they remove the batteries for much the same reason that you did; it's easier for them to do that than move their LARGE charger and tester out to the car. Their equipment may be attached to a wall or bench to keep it from " walking away".

A lot of places do, in fact, have a hand-held load tester and a medium duty charger on an extension cord. It depends more on what is convenient for them than any real functional difference.

[BusyWeb]

Hi, just for my 2 cents.
I'm not an expert on battery, but heard that need to be carful when charging a battery in-door.
Try it on open-space or make free air flow inside room where battery is charging.
When bettery is charging, it produces some harmful gas :??: :??:
I found this info from Wiki.
or Link to >>
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electric_battery
=============================
Battery hazards
A battery explosion is caused by the misuse or malfunction of a battery, such as attempting to recharge a primary (non-rechargeable) battery,[56] or short circuiting a battery.[57] With car batteries, explosions are most likely to occur when a short circuit generates very large currents. In addition, car batteries liberate hydrogen when they are overcharged (because of electrolysis of the water in the electrolyte). Normally the amount of overcharging is very small, as is the amount of explosive gas developed, and the gas dissipates quickly. However, when "jumping" a car battery, the high current can cause the rapid release of large volumes of hydrogen, which can be ignited by a nearby spark (for example, when removing the jumper cables).

When a battery is recharged at an excessive rate, an explosive gas mixture of hydrogen and oxygen may be produced faster than it can escape from within the walls of the battery, leading to pressure build-up and the possibility of the battery case bursting. In extreme cases, the battery acid may spray violently from the casing of the battery and cause injury. Overcharging—that is, attempting to charge a battery beyond its electrical capacity—can also lead to a battery explosion, leakage, or irreversible damage to the battery. It may also cause damage to the charger or device in which the overcharged battery is later used. Additionally, disposing of a battery in fire may cause an explosion as steam builds up within the sealed case of the battery.
=======================================

[Easy Rider]

I'm not an expert on battery, but heard that need to be carful when charging a battery in-door.


One needs to be careful with a battery regardless of what you are doing with it. :skull:

Your Wiki post is good but NONE of that is likely to happen (except maybe for dropping it and breaking the case) if you are using a small charger in a relatively open space that is not right next to an open flame. :cool:

[goneoutflying]

As for the car thing, if you can DRIVE it to the store in the first place, it can't be in THAT bad shape. I think you will find that they remove the batteries for much the same reason that you did; it's easier for them to do that than move their LARGE charger and tester out to the car. Their equipment may be attached to a wall or bench to keep it from " walking away".


I asked my father who used to work for Auto Zone for about three years. Their policy was to remove the battery to charge it to prevent any liability of the small chance that it may damage someones car. :)


Hi, just for my 2 cents.
I'm not an expert on battery, but heard that need to be carful when charging a battery in-door.
Try it on open-space or make free air flow inside room where battery is charging.
When bettery is charging, it produces some harmful gas :??: :??:


I charged it on my balcony :cool:

[Easy Rider]

I asked my father who used to work for Auto Zone for about three years. Their policy was to remove the battery to charge it to prevent any liability of the small chance that it may damage someones car. :)


Sorry, I forgot about the corporate stupidity factor!
It is, of course, true that if the employee does something REALLY stupid that causes the battery to explode......at least the customer's car won't be damaged in the process. :roll:

[goneoutflying]

Sorry, I forgot about the corporate stupidity factor!
It is, of course, true that if the employee does something REALLY stupid that causes the battery to explode......at least the customer's car won't be damaged in the process. :roll:

There are also those customers that will try to scam them by claiming that it damaged their car, when the car was already damaged. Unfortunately there are dishonest people everywhere.