Traffic automated turn arrows

[Orpheus]

Anybody have any experience with getting a ticket for running a light at a traffic-automated signal? The other night, on the way home from work, I waited through three full cycles of a traffic light without getting a green arrow, so I ran the light without knowing that there was a traffic camera at that intersection(until I saw the flash). Most of the lights around here have this problem, and usually a car will pull up beside me that triggers the signal, but the other night, on my way home from work, the roads were empty and I got tired of waiting. It seems that there is some sort of provision for this situation in most states, and I think I'll argue that the light was malfunctioning and I proceeded through the light under that assumption. If there was a living, breathing officer at the scene, I probably wouldn't have gotten a ticket at all, but since there was a camera, I'll probably have to take it to court and fight it. Any thoughts?

[Sarris]

Yo Orph;

There is some discussion on site for this issue. It may be helpful.

http://www.gz250bike.com/viewtopic.php?t=893

:tup:

[Orpheus]

I knew I'd seen that before; just forgot that it was here :blush:

[Easy Rider]

I waited through three full cycles of a traffic light without getting a green arrow, so I ran the light without knowing that there was a traffic camera at that intersection(until I saw the flash).

I have one question. If there were 3 "cycles", why didn't you "run" it when the traffic from your direction had the "normal" green ?? In that case, the camera should not have tripped.......I would think.

I'm assuming this is marked: Left on arrow only.
If not, I have a different question! ;)

P.S. You should also report it so it can be adjusted.......and so they will have a record of your report, should you actually get a ticket in the mail.

[Orpheus]

I waited through three full cycles of a traffic light without getting a green arrow, so I ran the light without knowing that there was a traffic camera at that intersection(until I saw the flash).

I have one question. If there were 3 "cycles", why didn't you "run" it when the traffic from your direction had the "normal" green ?? In that case, the camera should not have tripped.......I would think.

I'm assuming this is marked: Left on arrow only.
If not, I have a different question! ;)

P.S. You should also report it so it can be adjusted.......and so they will have a record of your report, should you actually get a ticket in the mail.

I was facing a circular steady green light, but this is one of those intersections where the left-turn arrow is independent of the circular green (with a "left turn on arrow only" sign above the arrow, as you stated), and the arrow is only actuated when the left turn sensor detects a vehicle in the turn lanes, so I was facing a red left turn arrow in my lane and the other turn lane beside me, and a steady circular green for the north/southbound lanes (I was northbound turning eastbound).
I wrote an email to the city's traffic enforcement division as well as the city's transportation department and an officer called me today who was very sympathetic but ultimately couldn't help me at all; he basically told me that I could try to fight it and hope that I get a judge who might be sympathetic.

I'm going to try to videotape this late one night for my defense if I do end up getting a ticket in the mail.

[Easy Rider]

I'm going to try to videotape this late one night for my defense if I do end up getting a ticket in the mail.

It might not be as hard to fight as you think. The placement of the cameras does not change the basic laws that are in effect. Most places have a "malfunctioning control device" exception. Alas, some places that put in the cameras made the tickets a CIVIL matter with any appeals to some kind of "panel" and not a real Judge. I would trust a judge more than some beauracrats on a panel.

Hopefully a human being with a brain is screening the things and you will never hear anything from it.
In the mean time, you might want to check on the exception and appeal.........just incase.

[davtnn]

We hav the same thing here ... the only lights in town and they have a trip tredle to activate turn arrows.. the GZ will not trip the light .. i have to wait for a car to come along .. i have tried all positions to get it to activate.. no luck// SO i just back up and make a right go to the next road and do a U turn... I am going to talk to some one in city hall but that will only cause a bunch of confusion... (this place aint normal anyway... )

[Orpheus]

I'm going to try to videotape this late one night for my defense if I do end up getting a ticket in the mail.

It might not be as hard to fight as you think. The placement of the cameras does not change the basic laws that are in effect. Most places have a "malfunctioning control device" exception. Alas, some places that put in the cameras made the tickets a CIVIL matter with any appeals to some kind of "panel" and not a real Judge. I would trust a judge more than some beauracrats on a panel.

Hopefully a human being with a brain is screening the things and you will never hear anything from it.
In the mean time, you might want to check on the exception and appeal.........just incase.

I checked the Arizona Revised Statutes and there is a provision for "inoperative" lights, but I don't know if this exactly covers my situation. Here's the relevant text:

C. The driver of a vehicle approaching an intersection that has an official traffic control signal that is inoperative shall bring the vehicle to a complete stop before entering the intersection and may proceed with caution only when it is safe to do so. If two or more vehicles approach an intersection from different streets or highways at approximately the same time and the official traffic control signal for the intersection is inoperative, the driver of each vehicle shall bring the vehicle to a complete stop before entering the intersection and the driver of the vehicle on the left shall yield the right-of-way to the driver of the vehicle on the right.

Hopefully you're right and I don't even receive a ticket.

[Tonckawa]

Most traffic signals these days have buried sensors to detect when a vehicle (metal) is present. Modern technology uses these buried sensors to detect when a vehicle is waiting. You can identify these lights by the square or round saw cuts in the pavement. They're most prevalent in left turn lanes. I'm sure you know what I mean. These buried sensors work a lot like a metal detector, relying on "seeing" some metal to interrupt their magnetic field to let them know someone is there to activate the traffic light changer circuitry. There just are not enough steel parts in a motorcycle for the sensors to see you. If they can't see your bike, they'll never change for you.

There is a device called a Motorcyclist's Buddy or something similiar. It is a magnet and helps the sensor detect you.

[finallyinthesaddle]

The Green Light Trigger HP is one of many devices that is supposed to let stoplights "see" us. I have one on order and will let you all know how it works.

The town I live in has no less that 30 stoplights, and it is next to impossible for me to (quickly) get to work without going through at least one of them. Pretty much anywhere I want to go in town requires tripping the sensor, and I seem to always want to turn at stoplights that no one else wants to use. Just last week I had to go 4 minutes out of my way (after waiting for two full cycles at a stoplight during "rush hour" [used loosely]) just to get to the bike shop.

[Easy Rider]

The town I live in has no less that 30 stoplights, and it is next to impossible for me to (quickly) get to work without going through at least one of them.

Has anyone mentioned here that those things are adjustable ?? Well, they ARE. Some Public Works departments will be more than happy to check the adjustments on them if they don't trip for you.....this is as it should be.....they work for US.
Some will even invite you to bring the bike to use for a test.

The PW folks in other towns, however, are run by pricks who won't even talk to you.
If I lived in a place like that, I think I'd be visiting the next city council meeting.

Anyhow, give it a try. Most places it is well worth the (small) trouble.

:tup:

[Orpheus]

Well, it's been almost a week and I still haven't received a ticket in the mail. Hopefully I won't.
Interesting side note about the cameras that many communities are using for this type of enforcement: they don't actually issue traffic tickets, but rather send a letter that states "This is not a ticket. There is no fine associated with this notice". Basically what they are is a "tattletale ticket" where you fill in the information about who was driving the car when the violation supposedly occurred and then they send an actual traffic ticket to that person; if you don't respond, they don't have a violator. I'm not sure about the 100% legality of this, but after some research on the internet (which should be taken with a grain of salt), I found numerous websites that propose that you simply disregard the notice and they won't contact you again (again, this isn't legal advice, but just random internet chatter). Interesting stuff anyway.

[Water Warrior 2]

Another fairly successful way to trigger traffic lights is to shut off the engine and restart it. The magnetic field of the starter will usually trigger the signals. I know it will work with the VStrom but haven't tried it with the GZ.

[davtnn]

somebody suggested riding the sensor seams .. i tried it and it works .....

[Orpheus]

somebody suggested riding the sensor seams .. i tried it and it works .....

I was talking to an officer and he said that they have all kinds of problems around here with the sensors not being calibrated correctly due to the excessive swelling and contracting of the blacktop because of the heat. I'll try this next time, though.

[primal]

I was talking to an officer and he said that they have all kinds of problems around here with the sensors not being calibrated correctly due to the excessive swelling and contracting of the blacktop because of the heat. I'll try this next time, though.

I wouldn't think that would have much affect on inductive sensors...

[patrick_777]

I was talking to an officer and he said that they have all kinds of problems around here with the sensors not being calibrated correctly due to the excessive swelling and contracting of the blacktop because of the heat. I'll try this next time, though.

I wouldn't think that would have much affect on inductive sensors...

It would if it sinks/pushes the sensor wire farther down into the roadway, or breaks a couple of links.

[primal]

I was talking to an officer and he said that they have all kinds of problems around here with the sensors not being calibrated correctly due to the excessive swelling and contracting of the blacktop because of the heat. I'll try this next time, though.

I wouldn't think that would have much affect on inductive sensors...

It would if it sinks/pushes the sensor wire farther down into the roadway, or breaks a couple of links.

Ah, good point. :tup:

[Orpheus]

I was talking to an officer and he said that they have all kinds of problems around here with the sensors not being calibrated correctly due to the excessive swelling and contracting of the blacktop because of the heat. I'll try this next time, though.

I wouldn't think that would have much affect on inductive sensors...

It would if it sinks/pushes the sensor wire farther down into the roadway, or breaks a couple of links.

Yeah, I think that's what he meant.

[patrick_777]

I was talking to an officer and he said that they have all kinds of problems around here with the sensors not being calibrated correctly due to the excessive swelling and contracting of the blacktop because of the heat. I'll try this next time, though.

I wouldn't think that would have much affect on inductive sensors...

It would if it sinks/pushes the sensor wire farther down into the roadway, or breaks a couple of links.

Yeah, I think that's what he meant.

Which is why I explained it that way. :tongue:

[LilNinja77]

Another fairly successful way to trigger traffic lights is to shut off the engine and restart it.

Yep, that one works for me on the trouble lights. But you don't have to shut the engine off, all you have to do is tap the starter button. Don't hold it in or anything, just tap it enough to cycle it once or twice, that's all it takes to trip the magnetic sensors. I've yet to have a light fail to trip when using this method, even on lights that otherwise I could not ever get to notice the bike.

There's one particular light very near me that is horrible, one night around 2 in the morning I went up there just for grins and giggles and waited to see how long it would take. There's no traffic, so I was free to do whatever I wanted. First I tried parking on the seam/line........nothing. Next I tried putting the kickstand down on the line/seam......nothing. I turned the bike off and just sat there, and 10 minutes later nothing had happened. I turned the key on and thumbed the starter, and within 5 seconds the light changed to green. Now I can roll up there and when I know the light is supposed to turn green for me, I'll just thumb the starter button and it never fails to work.
Ride safe